From - Wed May 21 10:36:30 1997 Return-Path: Majordomo-Owner@lists.teleport.com Received: (from daemon@localhost) by greta.teleport.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id KAA10068; Wed, 21 May 1997 10:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 21 May 1997 10:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199705211721.KAA10068@greta.teleport.com> To: rossy@teleport.com From: Majordomo@teleport.com Subject: Majordomo file: list 'krnet-l' file 'v01.n016' Reply-To: Majordomo@teleport.com X-UIDL: 06410dd4fa679549d4b365aa2535a0b2 X-Mozilla-Status: 0001 Content-Length: 42120 -- From: owner-krnet-l-digest@ (krnet-l-digest) To: krnet-l-digest@lists.teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V1 #16 Reply-To: krnet-l-digest Sender: owner-krnet-l-digest@ Errors-To: owner-krnet-l-digest@ Precedence: bulk krnet-l-digest Saturday, May 17 1997 Volume 01 : Number 016 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:31:51 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: GPS Stuff (No archive) Ron Lee wrote: > > At 13:23 97/5/15 -0400, you wrote: > >Check out the following page for another moving map option: > > > > http://www.free-flt.com/ > > > >-- > >Patrick Flowers Mailto:patri63@ibm.net > > > > I just checked it out. For the person (Ross?) who asked why they > should consider a moving map GPS unit instead of a laptop, this > link may prove to totally eliminate the GPS moving map from > consideration. > > Ron Ron, I couldn't agree more with that! If I can figure a way to make the $125.00 GPS reciever I got work with ANY GPS then you could concieveibility get this going for $125 for the TripMate GPS plus $279 for this software. The trick is that the DeLomar GPS appears to ONLY work with DeLomar software. This means you have to buy a Garmin GPS35 for $279 until this problem can be fixed. I'm looking HARD at designing a two LCD redundant glass cockpit that would incorporate this software. The trick is to use cheap PC components, buy two of each, and have them connected so that you can monitor failure between the units for reduncancy. The worst link in this today is Windows95 and the probability of a CRASH or Lock. I think the technology is all available, someone just needs to put it together. If mainstream components are used, the system can upgrade when new PC technology is created, perhaps the sensor module should be a PCI or PCMIA card module. -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:33:22 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist (no archive) Ron Lee wrote: > > At 12:48 97/5/15 -0700, you wrote: > snip > > We actually are not too far from the Rutan Laptop cockpit, the only > >problem I see is Windows95. I wouldn't like to get the following > >response on Final approach: > > > > "Altimeter: TASK NOT RESPONDING Code 0x3ffb23s at Address 0x823552" > > > > End Task or SHUTDOWN? > > > > -- Ross > > > > Easy solution...use windows 3.1 > > Ron Lee Windows 3.1 has other problems in this area. Windows 95 actually has some minor improvements here. -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:35:57 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Shadbolt Cam Grinders David Moore wrote: ... > If an modern auto engine in the family car makes HP at 4800-5200 RPM, and > the torque is at 2200 RPM, when you reach cruise(in A/C) and hit head wind > you will have to go back to almost full power to mantain alt. Therefore a > mild grind on the cam to increase the torque curve to say 4000 RPM(cruise > RPM) will solve the problem, and give a better performing engine. > Well... I'm not going to spin my VW at 4000RPM... perhaps a Soob with reduction drive. Can you say Supersonic Prop tips? -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:38:37 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Re: My GPS Wishlist John, Too late... I blew $179 for the Tripmate GPS with Software. It uses standard GPS serial codes, so I'm thinking I can hack a driver to make it happy with other software. What did MentorPlus build? I havent a clue. -- Ross John Bouyea wrote: > > Ross, > I used to work at MentorPlus. Give me a call before you sent $$ > anywhere... > > bou > KR2S - Almost ready to glue the first fuse side together... > John/Johnna Bouyea > johnbouyea@worldnet.att.net > > ---------- > > From: Ross Youngblood > > To: krnet-l@teleport.com > > Subject: KR: My GPS Wishlist > > Date: Wednesday, May 14, 1997 11:19 PM > > > > Looking at the website, I've come up with my GPS wish list. > > http://www.navtechgps.com/ > > > > GPS35 TracPac PC #6254 $275 (12 Satellite GPS reciever) > > Vista Software #2240-1 $199 (Core software) > > US 48 Sectionals #2246-0 $ 0 > > --------------------------------- > > $474 > > > > So for $474, I can use my laptop for a moving map display, and > > update the maps whenever I buy a new sectional just by running it > > into the scanner. If you don't own a scanner, you can take your > > sectionals to Kinkos and have them scanned onto a floppy for about > > $7.00 a page. > > > > The only thing you don't get with this setup is WARNINGS when you > > fly into RESTRICTED Airspace, and your frequencies don't come up. > > However, since the reciever sends ASCII code to your serial port, > > you can imagine it would be pretty easy for someone to write software > > to fix that. Hmmm... > > > > I'm really close to cutting a check for this. Anyone have a good > > reason I should spend $895 for a handheld instead? I'm listening? > > > > If I do this, I will let everyone know how it runs on my Omnibook > > and my Dell Laptop. (One runs Windows 3.1, the other Windows 95). > > > > -- Ross > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------> > Ross Youngblood > > Product Specialist > > Schlumberger Automatic Test Equipment > > Snail Mail: 1109 NE Burke Pl > > Corvallis Oregon > > email: rossy@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (business) > > rossy@teleport.com (non-business) > > Pager: (800)SKY-PAGE PIN#895-9073 Voicemail (800)538-6838 x1632 > > Bus Line: (541)714-1754 Cell Phone:(503)881-0692 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:49:20 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: inspection covers ginnwj wrote: > > Robert Lasecki wrote: > > > > I have been concerned since starting to build as to where to place > > inspection covers. Last night I went through the entire set of wonderful > > plans and instructions which were not included in the price of my "complete" > > KR-2S kit. Nowhere in the documents does it say anything about providing > > for any inspection access. I like the idea of clear covers as it makes > > inspections easier and allows each preflight to be more thorough. Any > > further comments on inspection plates would be quite welcomed. > > These wonderful plans don't even show where to fit seatbelts, so don't > expect details of fancy windows no matter how good an idea they are. > > Just about everything with the KR-2 is builder choice. In other words > a poor set of plans. > > Bill Well, Although I have to agree with you to an extent... you get what you pay for in a sense. I haven't priced the other VW or Soob based kits recently but at the time the KR was the most economical (or so it seemed). I'd recommend a Glastar or somthing like this if you want all the details worked out... these kits sound terrific... but they are $$$$. -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:53:00 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Current Plans?(what color is your foam?) Donald Reid wrote: > > > I have gotten both pink and tan from AS&S and I couldn't tell the difference. > -- > Don Reid > donreid@erols.com I too have gotten both. I don't recall a difference in sanding or rigidity. I recall reading somthing once about the manufacturer closing down the line, or selling it to someone else, so the supply was interupted for some time about two years ago. I never noticed a shortage or anything, so perhaps it was just hearsay. -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:57:12 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Current Plans? EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > > Ok, here's a really dumb question, seeing as how I'm about to start on my > wings already... I bought my plans in November of 94, have there been any > "official" updates since then? The hair started standing up on the back of > my neck while I was working on "the bird" today as that thought flashed > through my mind. It's always something... Well. I don't know of any big show stoppers... don't close the wing over the wing tanks until AFTER you LEAK TEST the tanks...!!!!! I bet that's not in the plans. I'ts much easier to open the tank and patch leaks this way! I bought my plans in Dec '88. I haven't seen any new plans... maybe someone can bring their set to the Gathering in Sept and we can compare notes. I think the pointy end of the wing goes to the back, and the blunt end in front. -- Ross - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 22:47:58 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Re: My GPS Wishlist At 10:38 PM 5/16/97 -0700, you wrote: >John, > Too late... I blew $179 for the Tripmate GPS with Software. It >uses standard GPS serial codes, so I'm thinking I can hack a driver >to make it happy with other software. > > What did MentorPlus build? I havent a clue. Ross will the trip mate track over 99 mph? Most of the cheeper units will only track about 99 mph and thats it! _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 23:11:58 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: Email Test Requests (IN ERROR) A few new subscribers may have gotten some KRNET email tests tonight. I was going through 137 new emails tonight, and fell into some old requests for subscriptions.... someday I will automate this the form on my webpage just sends me an email. If you really want automated service send an email to: mailto:majordomo@teleport.com With the body text: help krnet-l or just help. It will tell you what options you can do as a member. - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 23:13:20 -0700 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: Free Flight Ron, That Free Flight website http://www.free-flt.com/ffwpl007.htm is COOL! I think it is worth the $279. - -- Ross Youngblood KRNET-L administrator mailto:rossy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 1997 23:46:03 -0700 From: R Covington Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist (no archive) >At 12:48 97/5/15 -0700, you wrote: >snip >> We actually are not too far from the Rutan Laptop cockpit, the only >>problem I see is Windows95. I wouldn't like to get the following >>response on Final approach: >> >> "Altimeter: TASK NOT RESPONDING Code 0x3ffb23s at Address 0x823552" >> >> End Task or SHUTDOWN? >> >> -- Ross >> > >Easy solution...use windows 3.1 > >Ron Lee Better solution, use Apple Powerbooks like Rutan does... :) Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 02:48:27 -0400 (EDT) From: EagleGator@aol.com Subject: KR: KR-2S Test Plan Ok, after much gnashing of teeth, I've got the draft test plan Randy mentioned uploaded at http://members.aol.com/eaglegator/kr2srev2.doc This is a preliminary draft, by no means complete, but I'm posting it as food for thought for the folks who are about to enter the flight test phase of their project. I hope you find it useful. It's in MS Word v6.0, and is best viewed in outline mode. Cheers! Rick Junkin EagleGator@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 01:13:20 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist (no archive) At 11:46 PM 5/16/97 -0700, you wrote: >Better solution, use Apple Powerbooks like Rutan does... > >:) > >Robert Covington Your right but apples go stale too! :-0 _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 02:55:40 -0700 From: R Covington Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist (no archive) >At 11:46 PM 5/16/97 -0700, you wrote: >>Better solution, use Apple Powerbooks like Rutan does... >> >>:) >> >>Robert Covington > > >Your right but apples go stale too! :-0 > >_______________________ >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >Micheal Mims Well, maybe if there is a worm in it. That plane does have a lot of Windoze. ;) Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 23:03:46 +1000 From: ginnwj Subject: Re: KR: Re: Current Plans? Curt Martin wrote: > > I'll let you know when mine arrive, > > Just dropped the check in the mail for the KR-2 and KR-2S supplement (also > asked for the KR-1B supplement as a design starting point for long wings..we'll > see if they include them or force me to pay another $60 for the KR-1 plans > too.) > > I would guess the plans have a revision date on them somewhere. > > Curt Martin (cmartin@america.com) > Ormond Beach, FL > http://www.america.com/~cmartin > > ---------- > > From: EagleGator@aol.com > > To: krnet-l@teleport.com > > Subject: KR: Current Plans? > > Date: Friday, May 16, 1997 1:00 AM > > > > Ok, here's a really dumb question, seeing as how I'm about to start on my > > wings already... I bought my plans in November of 94, have there been any > > "official" updates since then? The hair started standing up on the back of > > my neck while I was working on "the bird" today as that thought flashed > > through my mind. It's always something... > > > > Cheers! > > Rick Junkin > > EagleGator@aol.com These plans are revised and issued like the latest Phantom comic book. There is no formal notification of mandatory changes or revision of plans. The new plans like the S just get issued without any justification or reason. So what you have was the latest at the time they were issued. On the plus side, the basic KR plans are still the ones with all the details provided by Ken Rand the designer. Changes since then have not been justified, notified or explained. I'd be wary of the S plans, there aren't many flying and no one I know of has published a flight test of one so I suspect that the basic KR is the safest one to build. good luck Bill ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 23:22:51 +1000 From: ginnwj Subject: Re: KR: inspection covers Ross The KR has a lot of potential, it is a great shame that Ken Rand isn't around to continue the work he started. The plans describe a prototype, the plans themselves are prototype standard. The basic concept is still the best value for money, however the design needs some improvements, particularly with regard to the safety issue of stability. The seatbelt area also needs addressing as well as a number of other areas. However the stability is the most pressing problem and I wonder why someone in the aero business hasn't taken up the challenge. As far as I can see the first change is to increase the span of the stabilizer (which will require engineering work on the structural side). Somehow a safe CofG range has to be determined and a flight test is the best way to do this. I look forward to hearing from the fellow looking into a flight manual for the KR-2, particularly as he is basing it on the FAA's Advisory Circular No. 90-89A. I wonder if anyone has done a serious flight test of a KR-2 using 90-89A? Bill Ross Youngblood wrote: > > ginnwj wrote: > > > > Robert Lasecki wrote: > > > > > > I have been concerned since starting to build as to where to place > > > inspection covers. Last night I went through the entire set of wonderful > > > plans and instructions which were not included in the price of my "complete" > > > KR-2S kit. Nowhere in the documents does it say anything about providing > > > for any inspection access. I like the idea of clear covers as it makes > > > inspections easier and allows each preflight to be more thorough. Any > > > further comments on inspection plates would be quite welcomed. > > > > These wonderful plans don't even show where to fit seatbelts, so don't > > expect details of fancy windows no matter how good an idea they are. > > > > Just about everything with the KR-2 is builder choice. In other words > > a poor set of plans. > > > > Bill > > Well, > Although I have to agree with you to an extent... you get what you pay for > in a sense. I haven't priced the other VW or Soob based kits recently but > at the time the KR was the most economical (or so it seemed). I'd recommend > a Glastar or somthing like this if you want all the details worked out... these > kits sound terrific... but they are $$$$. > > -- Ross > > -- > Ross Youngblood > KRNET-L administrator > mailto:rossy@teleport.com > http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 23:25:03 +1000 From: ginnwj Subject: Re: KR: Current Plans? Ross Youngblood wrote: > > EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > > > > Ok, here's a really dumb question, seeing as how I'm about to start on my > > wings already... I bought my plans in November of 94, have there been any > > "official" updates since then? The hair started standing up on the back of > > my neck while I was working on "the bird" today as that thought flashed > > through my mind. It's always something... > > Well. I don't know of any big show stoppers... don't close the wing over the > wing tanks until AFTER you LEAK TEST the tanks...!!!!! I bet that's not in Best not put wing tanks in at all as they will place the CofG with two up far to far aft for stability. > the plans. I'ts much easier to open the tank and patch leaks this way! > > I bought my plans in Dec '88. I haven't seen any new plans... maybe someone > can bring their set to the Gathering in Sept and we can compare notes. I think > the pointy end of the wing goes to the back, and the blunt end in front. > > -- Ross > -- > Ross Youngblood > KRNET-L administrator > mailto:rossy@teleport.com > http://www.teleport.com/~rossy/N541RY.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 06:31:30 -0700 From: enewbold@sprynet.com Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist (no archive) Ross wrote: >>>We actually are not too far from the Rutan Laptop cockpit, the only >>>problem I see is Windows95. wouldn't like to get the following >>>response on Final approach: >>> "Altimeter: TASK NOT RESPONDING Code 0x3ffb23s at Address 0x823552" >>> End Task or SHUTDOWN? Ron Lee wrote: >> Easy solution...use windows 3.1 Ross responded: >Windows 3.1 has other problems in this area. Windows 95 actually >has some minor improvements here. The solution is to NOT rely only on any Windows product in you cockpit as the "primary" source of instrumentation. Win 3.1 and Win 95 are far too unstable to trust in that environment. I'm a professional PC programmer for Bank One, and all too often these products will sieze up for no obvious reason whatsoever. Yes, they do *usually* recover after a cold boot (hitting the power switch), but in my own aircraft I will continue to rely upon more traditional instrumentation. I use a Trimble handheld GPS as my primary navigation source and a cheap Garmin as my backup. However, my REAL source of navigation are my sectionals! Ed Newbold Columbus, OH ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 06:42:53 -0700 From: enewbold@sprynet.com Subject: Re: KR: KRs for Sale (No Archive) On Thu, 15 May 1997, Ron Lee wrote: >Following from the First May 1997 issue of Trade a Plane >2. KR-2 Stretch, retractable, 2 place, 44 TT, 1834 cc HAPI, >Ellison pressure carb, Sterba prop, aux tanks, $6500 or offer >503-391-0937 I just spoke with the owner/seller of this one. He sold it thursday afternoon (5/15). I didn't get the buyer's name. Ed Newbold Columbus, OH ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 10:32:10 -0400 (EDT) From: JEHayward@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Current Plans? In a message dated 97-05-17 09:32:26 EDT, you write: << Best not put wing tanks in at all as they will place the CofG with two up far to far aft for stability. >> Is this true for the KR2 only or for the 2-S as well? Jim Hayward ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 10:42:56 -0400 (EDT) From: JEHayward@aol.com Subject: KR: Floorboard Anyone using foam or some sort of additional reinforcing between the floorboard and the bottom of the fuselage. I have these visions of the thing breaking from someone stepping into the cockpit and going thru the fuselage. I was contemplating using a foam sandwich when installing the floorboard. Jim Hayward ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 11:56:11 -0400 (EDT) From: LVav8r@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Shadbolt Cam Grinders/PC Dyno In a message dated 97-05-17 01:26:00 EDT, you write: << Most VW cruise RPM's that I hear about are generally from 3100 to 3300. The people using them say that you can turn it faster but you don't want to be running it at 4000 RPM all day. Robert Covington >> I may be showing my ignorance here but if the dd soob guys are running their engines at 3800-4000 rpm then why not run the VW at a little higher rpm as well? I know that longevity could be a concern but how much would it be affected? Curt Martin shows a 1918cc VW putting out 98hp @ 4000rpm in his PC Dyno chart. If you could use 4000 for takeoff and climb and 3800 for cruise then a VW might just still be the best choice for the KR. I would still want to use a 2180 myself. Most of the KR's are already using shorter props so tip speed shouldn't be much of a problem, although a little less pitch might be required. I've been thinking about using a dd soob myself but am still a long way from making a definite engine choice, a dd Legacy w/turbo seems like an intresting combo but if the VW can make nearly 100hp at less than 200lbs firewall forward then it may actually be a little faster in climb and cruise. Just thinking out loud. Tom Kilgore Las Vegas, NV LVav8r@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 09:30:08 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Re: Current Plans? At 11:03 PM 5/17/97 +1000, you wrote: <<< On the plus side, the basic KR plans are still the >ones with all the details provided by Ken Rand the designer. >I'd be wary of the S plans, there aren't many flying and no one I know >of has published a flight test of one so I suspect that the basic KR is >the safest one to build. >Bill Uhh... Ken didn't design it (the kr) he modified an existing design, and give us some time man, we just got started a year or two ago! _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 09:33:09 -0700 From: David Turley Subject: Re: KR: My GPS Wishlist Ross Youngblood wrote: > > Looking at the website, I've come up with my GPS wish list. > http://www.navtechgps.com/ > > GPS35 TracPac PC #6254 $275 (12 Satellite GPS reciever) > Vista Software #2240-1 $199 (Core software) > US 48 Sectionals #2246-0 $ 0 > --------------------------------- > $474 > > So for $474, I can use my laptop for a moving map display, and > update the maps whenever I buy a new sectional just by running it > into the scanner. If you don't own a scanner, you can take your > sectionals to Kinkos and have them scanned onto a floppy for about > $7.00 a page. > > The only thing you don't get with this setup is WARNINGS when you > fly into RESTRICTED Airspace, and your frequencies don't come up. > However, since the reciever sends ASCII code to your serial port, > you can imagine it would be pretty easy for someone to write software > to fix that. Hmmm... > > I'm really close to cutting a check for this. Anyone have a good > reason I should spend $895 for a handheld instead? I'm listening? > > If I do this, I will let everyone know how it runs on my Omnibook > and my Dell Laptop. (One runs Windows 3.1, the other Windows 95). > > -- Ross Ross, I agree- this looks like the total deal to me- for half the cost of a used CDI for an old King VHF nav receiver, too! (Assuming you already own the laptop, of course!) We really have made progress in the last few years. - -- David Turley http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/5774/ mailto:daturley@tscnet.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 10:43:06 -0600 (MDT) From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: Engine HP (no archive) Curt Martin shows a 1918cc VW putting out 98hp @ 4000rpm in his PC >Dyno chart. If you could use 4000 for takeoff and climb and 3800 for cruise >then a VW might just still be the best choice for the KR. I would still want >to use a 2180 myself. > >Tom Kilgore >Las Vegas, NV >LVav8r@aol.com > I have a Revmaster spec sheet that shows 75 HP at 3200 rpm for a 2074 cc engine. Does that coincide with the dyno chart you mention? Ron Lee ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 09:42:05 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Current Plans? At 10:32 AM 5/17/97 -0400, you wrote: >In a message dated 97-05-17 09:32:26 EDT, you write: > ><< Best not put wing tanks in at all as they will place the CofG with two > up far to far aft for stability. >> > > Is this true for the KR2 only or for the 2-S as well? > Its not true in either case! BY putting the fuel close or on the CG, fuel burn will not have any effect on CG, therefor it will not effect stability . AS far as stability goes, set your CG where it should be by mounting the engine where it should be, and don't use the last two inches that the manual calls out for in your CG range. I think the CG range published in the plans was an error that has never been corrected. Have fun! _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 09:45:02 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Floorboard At 10:42 AM 5/17/97 -0400, you wrote: > Anyone using foam or some sort of additional reinforcing between the >floorboard and the bottom of the fuselage. I have these visions of the thingbreaking from someone stepping into the cockpit and going thru the fuselage. I was contemplating using a foam sandwich when installing the floorboard. > >Jim Hayward > I used foam but not for reinforcing, its more of a insulation thing, PLEASE don't ever let anyone step on your floor! They WILL go through! The only area designed for supporting weight is the seat sling which is supported by the two spars. The floor is not designed to carry that kind of load! _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 09:51:07 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: KR: HIGH RPM was (Shadbolt Cam Grinders/PC Dyno) At 11:56 AM 5/17/97 -0400, you wrote: I may be showing my ignorance here but if the dd soob guys are running their engines at 3800-4000 rpm then why not run the VW at a little higher rpm as well? I know that longevity could be a concern but how much would it be affected? Curt Martin shows a 1918cc VW putting out 98hp @ 4000rpm in his PC............. I think there is major concern about the rubber band popping! Seriously, the VW has been in the air for a long time, if we could turn it that fast and get away with it people would be doing it! The Soob is just stronger in that respect and its water cooled to help dissipate the extra heat from generating the extra HP. _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 13:18:27 -0400 From: Carlos Sa Subject: RE: KR: /plans/ inspection covers I'd say there is an option to be considered: the Vision, from American Affordable Aircraft... It seems to have been inspired on the KR: all (or most) of the KR weaknesses have been addressed, and is still reasonably affordable. Plans and documentation sell for about US$400. It's a fairly new project: the prototype is flying, and a few units (5-6) are being built... http://members.aol.com/visionflyr/index.html (Am I being heretic? :o) ) KRnetters: Any comments on Vision ? Carlos http://www.axess.com/user/wings - ---------- ginnwj wrote: > ... > These wonderful plans don't even show where to fit seatbelts, so don't > expect details of fancy windows no matter how good an idea they are. > > Just about everything with the KR-2 is builder choice. In other words > a poor set of plans. > > Bill Well, Although I have to agree with you to an extent... you get what you pay for in a sense. I haven't priced the other VW or Soob based kits recently but at the time the KR was the most economical (or so it seemed). I'd recommend a Glastar or somthing like this if you want all the details worked out... these kits sound terrific... but they are $$$$. -- Ross begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A\1`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$-@ 0` M`@````(``@`!!) &`" !```!````# ````,``# %````"P`/#@`````"`?\/ M`0```$<`````````@2L?I+ZC$!F=;@#=`0]4`@````!K``(P`0````4` M``!33510`````!X``S !````%0```&MR;F5T+6Q =&5L97!O``$P`0```!<````G:W)N970M;$!T96QE<&]R M="YC;VTG```"`0LP`0```!H```!33510.DM23D54+4Q 5$5,15!/4E0N0T]- M`````P``.0`````+`$ Z`0````(!]@\!````! ````````4*-0$(@ <`& `` M`$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`02 `0`B````4D4Z($M2.B O M<&QA;G,O(&EN0,`!Q", M`P``'@`($ $```!E````241305E42$5214E304Y/4%1)3TY43T)%0T].4TE$ M15)%1#I42$5625-)3TXL1E)/34%-15))0T%.049&3U)$04),14%)4D-20494 M2513145-4U1/2$%614)%14Y)3E-025)%1 `````"`0D0`0```'L$``!W! `` M^@8``$Q:1G5CY]AE_P`*`0\"%0*H!>L"@P!0`O()`@!C: K -0* "H$-L0M@;F4!SA'](?``J% M9&]C]G4'@ (P82!#$; H02/A"Q_@!N!U!4!54R0T[# P+I E)R M !M!1!)!S+F$&\"X% MH&W,+W8B/LJ83I#=1&P.R #\!T`0=WC"T8647,Q-@J@-($SX?P@+4<'12T> M.44M&$$+\L5&AF<+@&YW:BH`1I*Z.@J%/B'F)/A,8%0?<,\1L"H``B $@69U M`R +4=,&,2_ ;B<%0&4F<#"!M&AO!^!W'W,@D68V\.\EL3! (, X8',BP"UP M3P3_2_<[<#3@1M$-L &0`Q _T7,I@#+P;F,?0$1A+\!W?00@;B"@`, ^LB9 M3^%G_F\$4_%$E%F#6 M1P`'\5\$$$>O2EL*A1DA`'R0``,`$! ``````P`1$ ````! ``9BO $>`#T``0````4```!213H@`````/?) ` end ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 13:30:22 -0700 From: Owen Davies Subject: Re: KR: Engine HP Speaking of HP and torque curves, does anyone have them for the 2.0-litre inline-four VW? Many thanks. Owen Davies ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 13:35:05 -0400 From: Vince Bozik Subject: KR: Wing Tanks(Do Not Archive) > Well. I don't know of any big show stoppers... don't close the wing over the > wing tanks until AFTER you LEAK TEST the tanks...!!!!! I bet that's not in > the plans. I'ts much easier to open the tank and patch leaks this way! Speaking of leak testing... I helped someone close up a Glasair wing last week. The wing tanks were, well, the section forward of the spar minus both wing tip bays. The tank was continuous from left to right, with a couple of flapper valves in the center tank bay(center of the wing) where the sump was located. In other words, when(and only when) you close up the wing, you close up the tank. I bet this guy's gonna cry if the thing leaks! He helped a friend close up one down in Florida, after hearing all of the nightmare-stories from some of the Stoddard guys. Well, him and his friend did it with no leaks! I've got the some pics on a funsaver, and will post them when I get them developed and scanned. Although, I have no Idea if they're any good. Vince Bozik - -- Vince Bozik - Athens, Georgia Mailto:ICBM@ix.netcom.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 13:55:57 -0400 From: Vince Bozik Subject: Re: KR: Floorboard > I used foam but not for reinforcing, its more of a insulation thing, > PLEASE don't ever let anyone step on your floor! They WILL go through! The > only area designed for supporting weight is the seat sling which is > supported by the two spars. The floor is not designed to carry that kind of > load! > > _______________________ > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Micheal Mims > Just Plane Nutts > mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com > > http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand Gee, I wonder why they call it a floor! The following is out of Bookshelf 95: floor (flôr, flor) noun Abbr. fl. 1. a. The surface of a room on which one stands. b. The lower or supporting surface of a structure. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition copyright © 1992 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from InfoSoft International, Inc. All rights reserved. Well, I know why it's called a floor. I guess a layer of foam, and a couple of glass or aramid would help the situation. I'd be really weary about allowing someone(even myself) entering without the possiblilty of slipping! Gee, I guess it wouldn't be a bat idea to put a "No Step" on the floor. Imagine the questions you'd have to answer for those not familiar with the KR! - -- Vince Bozik - Athens, Georgia Mailto:ICBM@ix.netcom.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 11:03:47 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Engine HP At 01:30 PM 5/17/97 -0700, you wrote: >Speaking of HP and torque curves, does anyone have them for >the 2.0-litre inline-four VW? > >Many thanks. > >Owen Davies > This from VWs home page, 2.0-liter SOHC 8-valve 4-in-line, 115 hp @ 5400rpm Maximum Torque 122 lb.-ft. @ 3,200 RPM sorry no torque curve, maybe Car and Drivers or Road and Tracks web sites? _______________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts mailto:mimsmand@ix.netcom.com http://www.netcom.com/~mimsmand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 May 1997 13:36:29 -0600 (MDT) From: Ron Lee Subject: RE: KR: plans & Vision A/C (no archive) The Vision is a nice looking plane. If the main gear were under the wings it would be very similar to a KR. The good thing about it is the wider cockpit (40") and likely detailed plans (425 pages in 7 volumes). Protoype weight is 900 lbs an it may require a 100 HP or better engine. The wing skins are glassed on the inside (Like Mark's?) and fuel is carried in front of the spar. MOre choices is good, and if better construction techniques can be applied to the KR...great. Not apparent is whether it is permitted to step on the floorboard. Ron At 13:18 97/5/17 -0400, you wrote: >I'd say there is an option to be considered: the >Vision, from American Affordable Aircraft... >It seems to have been inspired on the KR: all (or >most) of the KR weaknesses have been addressed, >and is still reasonably affordable. Plans and >documentation sell for about US$400. >It's a fairly new project: the prototype is flying, >and a few units (5-6) are being built... >http://members.aol.com/visionflyr/index.html >(Am I being heretic? :o) ) >KRnetters: Any comments on Vision ? > >Carlos > >http://www.axess.com/user/wings > >---------- > >ginnwj wrote: >> >... >> These wonderful plans don't even show where to fit seatbelts, so don't >> expect details of fancy windows no matter how good an idea they are. >> >> Just about everything with the KR-2 is builder choice. In other words >> a poor set of plans. >> >> Bill > >Well, > Although I have to agree with you to an extent... you get what you pay for >in a sense. I haven't priced the other VW or Soob based kits recently but >at the time the KR was the most economical (or so it seemed). I'd recommend >a Glastar or somthing like this if you want all the details worked out... these >kits sound terrific... but they are $$$$. > > -- Ross > >begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT >M>)\^(A\1`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$-@ 0` >M`@````(``@`!!) &`" !```!````# ````,``# %````"P`/#@`````"`?\/ >M`0```$<`````````@2L?I+ZC$!F=;@#=`0]4`@````!KM;W)T+F-O;0!33510`&MR;F5T+6Q =&5L97!O``(P`0````4` >M``!33510`````!X``S !````%0```&MR;F5T+6Q =&5L97!OM``,`%0P!`````P#^#P8````>``$P`0```!<````G:W)N970M;$!T96QE<&]R >M="YC;VTG```"`0LP`0```!H```!33510.DM23D54+4Q 5$5,15!/4E0N0T]- >M`````P``.0`````+`$ Z`0````(!]@\!````! ````````4*-0$(@ <`& `` >M`$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`02 `0`B````4D4Z($M2.B O >M<&QA;G,O(&ENM`!L`!@`J`0$@@ ,`#@```,T'!0`1``T`$@`;``8`*@$!"8 !`"$````R13%" >M1#M`",```````,`)@``````"P`I```````#`#8``````$ `.0"@,9I5YF*\`1X` >M< `!````(@```%)%.B!+4CH@+W!L86YS+R!I;G-P96-T:6]N(&-O=F5RM``(!<0`!````%@````&\8N95FI-3;LC.MQ'0C%E$15-4`````!X`'@P!```` >M!0```%--5% `````'@`?# $````&````=VEN9W,````#``80# VL>0,`!Q", >M`P``'@`($ $```!E````241305E42$5214E304Y/4%1)3TY43T)%0T].4TE$ >M15)%1#I42$5625-)3TXL1E)/34%-15))0T%.049&3U)$04),14%)4D-20494 >M2513145-4U1/2$%614)%14Y)3E-025)%1 `````"`0D0`0```'L$``!W! `` >M^@8``$Q:1G5CY]AE_P`*`0\"%0*H!>L"@P!0`O()`@!C: K M`H,R`\4"`'!R0G$1XG-T96T"@S-S!$83,S$@"%4'L@*#-.<1!14##]]F-0+D >M!Q,"@"Y]"H (SPG9.QG_,C4>-0* "H$-L0M@;FM($DG9"!S87E(('1H!)!E( 0`(#4#D6\%,&D"(!]0;R"^8A^@!: `@02!"8 Z >M'U*:( J%5@0`(%$L( -2UQB@!X %$&,#D4$-T 6PBF0!H&P?H$%I<@4`VF$! >M@"XD\ J%205 $;#O$^ $(""1$8!V'Z @P GP^Q^P`(!P)( )@" 0('$AP=Q+ >M4B&0!T #("@%L J%*P1@$\ I(!!F)Z4@=_!E86MN!Y 1L 0@)EB8861D&@`J >M<60L"H5_`' ?`!_!$\ #$ ,@&@!A/G,"("0A'T DP"/F+B >4!SA'](?``J% >M9&]C]G4'@ (P82!#$; H02/A"Q_@!N!U!4!54R0T[# P+I E)R >MM= 0@*#4M-M\I4 K )H(U<2"P=0,0).G": ) <#HO+P> !M!1!)!S+F$&\"X% >MH&W,+W8BM*0J%)_ J4 ) \SG1(9!!;A] .E$P`@0@LR!A(F0@/PJ%"H5#"L!M&9!S0*PY >M)7=#,#H`>/LJ83I#=1&P.R #\!T`0=WC"T8647,Q-@J@-($SX?P@+4<'12T> >M.44M&$$+\L5&AF<+@&YW:BH`1I*Z.@J%/B'F)/A,8%0?<,\1L"H``B $@69U >M`R +4=,&,2_ ;B<%0&4F<#"!M&AO!^!W'W,@D68V\.\EL3! (, X8',BP"UP >M3P3_2_<[<#3@1M$-L &0`Q _T7,I@#+P;F,?0$1A+\!W?00@;B"@`, ^LB9 >M3^%G_F\$MI2T1X/\?P3@R!($@X$_0(W N@3W0_DD@`1]B3@$+($'63& RT/YP59 %P!&Q >M*6).LU;?3&!V0BT!0*Q7,+$K]CW00?,X8$_0=6=9D#R0)E,@D?9A"<)95'D( >M8&)3`Z [<.\3T (P)/%C,V==@5 0,$#_8S,*L!] (^$*A0N ,L$1L/\`@%M" >M8?1/,A-06R$?`"&R65O$5E<@$ 7 4U608O<@L"U@)U%K-O(:`%LP`C#_+<$X >M,%(&92$ALB! !X IE_\M8"&C*1)/8"#Q`W C<2A3[U&"4+,3X F *6<2'O%J >M4>4_M_W(P)V$Q8&1"'V$1L J%:@/_+7 VT&@Q!) &@2-P9$)JX?E61R D>%$E%F#6 >M1P`'\5\$$$>O2EL*A1DA`'R0``,`$! ``````P`1$ ````! ``DO % ``@PP-*A5>9BO $>`#T``0````4```!213H@`````/?) >` >end > > ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V1 #16 ****************************