From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Monday, December 29, 1997 5:16 PM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V1 #201 krnet-l-digest Monday, December 29 1997 Volume 01 : Number 201 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 15:29:30, -0500 From: YCGB97A@prodigy.com (MR JEAN R VERON) Subject: KR: Internet Message MIke I know where Lances plane is now and it does not have the flaperons. When the current owner flew it to OSH after referbishing it he told Lance that he was the new owner and Lance didn't even want to discuss it. It has been converted to a tri-gear and had flaps in the stub wing. It would be interesting to find out why the flaperons are not there. Jean N4DD ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 15:18:47 -0600 From: Jim Faughn Subject: Re: KR: Nylaflow brake lines? Mark Langford wrote: > BrakeLineHeads, > > I seem to vaguely remember somebody saying that Nylaflow(R!) brake lines > might melt if connected directly to the caliper, especially during extended > taxi tests. Has anyone had this experience? I have both the 5052-0 and > Nylaflow tubing on hand, so I can go either way, but I'd rather use > Nylaflow due to the ease of bending and lack of fatigue problems. I could > use the aluminum just for the last few feet, but the caliper does move a > little bit, and I don't want to do the fatigue arresting coil thing for > aerodynamic reasons. Any opinions? Anybody connect Nylaflow directly to > the caliper and live to tell about it? I don't plan to do a whole lot of > taxi testing. Probably a couple of trips down the runway to get the feel > for it and then a firewall job... > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL > email at langford@hiwaay.net > KR2S project construction at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford I used Nylaflow tubing and haven't had any problems. - -- Jim Faughn N8931JF St. Louis, MO (314) 652-7659 or (573) 465-8039 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 13:08:56 +0000 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Nylaflow brake lines? At 08:17 AM 12/28/97 -0600, you wrote: >BrakeLineHeads, > >I seem to vaguely remember somebody saying that Nylaflow(R!) brake lines >might melt if connected directly to the caliper, especially during extended >taxi tests. Has anyone had this experience? This happened to a Defiant and she burned to the ground, I asked Brad about it and he has nylaflow all the way to his brakes and has had no problems and it shows no weird signs of melting after 500+ hours. Maybe on heavy aircraft with large brakes there would be an issue but it seems with the light brake applications its OK to use the plastic line to the caliper. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Dec 1997 22:50:52 -0800 From: tomstokes1@juno.com (Wayland T. Stokes) Subject: Re: KR: E-Mail to RR was KR2S Drawings Oscar She registered mine for me and it was orginally started in 1977 and I am the 3rd owner. Tom in Reno NV On Mon, 08 Dec 1997 06:23:35 PST "Oscar Zuniga" writes: > > >><< You might also try an email to pilot@fly-kr.com (also from the KR >> Homepage). >> >> >> I once sent an e-mail to them and never got a response. > >Yep, this is what I did back in September before I first got on the >Net. >But then Mike Stearns was kind enough to reply, and to steer me here. >I >don't know if he is still doing that, though. Apparently R-R uses the > >e-mail address as a come-on, but it isn't actively supported. BTW- I >wrote to Jeanette a week ago or so, asking about re-registering the >plans I bought from Ricky Pitman (he never built his KR-2); we'll see >what she says. My purpose was to try to buy a set of the -2S >supplement >without having to buy a whole new set of KR-2 plans. I am prepared to > >buy the whole enchilada again, but obviously would rather not have to. > >Oscar > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:39:24 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: Re: Possible error in manual? MikeTnyc wrote: > I'm sure we're all shocked to imagine that there might be an error in the > manual, but perhaps the unthinkable has finally happened. I've always thought that if the engine mount were designed properly (with the four firewall points connecting to the firewall within an inch or two of the longerons) that it would be senseless to run that angle all the way across. I'm just going to use about four inches of it at each location, and I'll epoxy/flox it well, as well as bolting. I offer no engineering explanation for my rash actions other than what I consider to be pure common sense... As for the answer to your real question, many would argue that Lance does better documentation than most of his competition. Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL email at langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project construction at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:15:22 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Phoenix bound gang Troy, (& Others in Phoenix) Sorry I couldn't hook up with you while I was in Phoenix. I got a head cold on the 19th on the way down, and was sicker than a dog thru Monday. Monday I skipped my taildragger flying time, and opted just for the ground portion, then went up Tuesday morning at 7:00. I got another hour of dual in the Piper Cub on the 26th, and that was all the leisure time I was allowed to have. The remainder of the time I had in Phoenix was spent sleeping to recover/fight this cold, and meet all the family that we had in Phoenix. Hopefully I can do better next time... I did however pass the WYLE building on the way to Tempe... this doesn't count much, but it was the best I could do. -- Regards Ross Troy Johnson wrote: > > Okay guys, > > Heard from Don Ball last night, he made it into town okay and is anxious to > hook up with some KR Netters/builders. I am going to see if I need to > reserve any space at the Deer Valley airport restaraunt for either the > evening of the 27th (I have to work during the day) or the afternoon of the > 28th. If anyone has any objections let me know. If you want to get a hold > of Don he is at 602-872-7264 and if you want to contact me I am at > 602-416-2158.....Troy > > ************************************************************* > > If at first you don't succeed.....so much for skydiving! > > Troy A. Johnson > WYLE Electronics > 1955 E. Sky Harbor Circle North > Phoenix, AZ 85034 > (602)-495-9953 > (602)-416-2158 (direct) > > ************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:33:11 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: [Fwd: BOUNCE krnet-l@lists.teleport.com: Non-member submission from [Linda Bennett ]] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------1CFBAE393F54BC7EFF6D5DF Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The attached post is from Steve Bennett 12/18. (I'm getting caught up on my email) Steve, do you want me to subscribe you at this address? -- Ross - -- KRNET-L Administrator !!! REMEMBER POSTS GO TO !!! krnet@krnet.org !!! KRNET-L@teleport.com !!! rossy@teleport.com !!! NOT krnet@krnet.org !!! http://www.krnet.org - --------------1CFBAE393F54BC7EFF6D5DF Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Received: by smtp3 for krnet (with Cubic Circle's cucipop (v1.21 1997/08/10) Sun Dec 28 19:21:36 1997) X-From_: krnet-l-owner Thu Dec 18 17:10:37 1997 Return-Path: owner-krnet-l@lists.teleport.com Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp4.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) id RAA19554; Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:10:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:10:36 -0800 (PST) From: owner-krnet-l@teleport.com Message-Id: <199712190110.RAA19554@smtp4.teleport.com> To: owner-krnet-l@teleport.com Subject: BOUNCE krnet-l@lists.teleport.com: Non-member submission from [Linda Bennett ] >From krnet-l-owner Thu Dec 18 17:10:34 1997 Received: from iceland.it.earthlink.net (iceland-c.it.earthlink.net [204.119.177.28]) by smtp4.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA19033 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:08:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from 153.36.249.151 (1Cust151.tnt16.dfw5.da.uu.net [153.36.249.151]) by iceland.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA26099 for ; Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:08:11 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34997540.2FF2@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 19:10:56 +0000 From: Linda Bennett Reply-To: ag367@earthlink.net Organization: Great Plains Aircraft Supply Co. Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0-C-NSCP (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: krnet-l@teleport.com Subject: Re:have to ask question References: <01bd0bfe$768ea320$LocalHost@jrcasey> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Since I have been on the KR net, I am taken back by the negative comments by many builders. The KR is not a new aircraft. It has been around for 25 years. If you don't trust the plans, can't talk to successful builders/flyers, why would you even consider building the plane. The KR offers performance/ and reasonable price! Look at the many/many KR aircraft that have been built successfully. Why be negative about a plane that you want to spend X$ on, and years of your life building.. If thats the case, maybe a BD is on your mind. Steve Bennett I've been accused of being with the good old boy network, but value has its place and the KR have value. - --------------1CFBAE393F54BC7EFF6D5DF-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:33:39 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: [Fwd: BOUNCE krnet-l@lists.teleport.com: Non-member submission from [Linda Bennett ]] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------31DFF4F5237C228A2F1CF0FB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - -- KRNET-L Administrator !!! REMEMBER POSTS GO TO !!! krnet@krnet.org !!! KRNET-L@teleport.com !!! rossy@teleport.com !!! NOT krnet@krnet.org !!! http://www.krnet.org - --------------31DFF4F5237C228A2F1CF0FB Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Received: by smtp3 for krnet (with Cubic Circle's cucipop (v1.21 1997/08/10) Sun Dec 28 19:24:54 1997) X-From_: krnet-l-owner Tue Dec 23 14:03:46 1997 Return-Path: owner-krnet-l@lists.teleport.com Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp4.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) id OAA22061; Tue, 23 Dec 1997 14:03:42 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 14:03:42 -0800 (PST) From: owner-krnet-l@teleport.com Message-Id: <199712232203.OAA22061@smtp4.teleport.com> To: owner-krnet-l@teleport.com Subject: BOUNCE krnet-l@lists.teleport.com: Non-member submission from [Linda Bennett ] >From krnet-l-owner Tue Dec 23 14:03:40 1997 Received: from iceland.it.earthlink.net (iceland-c.it.earthlink.net [204.119.177.28]) by smtp4.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA21881 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 1997 14:02:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from 153.36.249.9 (1Cust9.tnt16.dfw5.da.uu.net [153.36.249.9]) by iceland.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03838 for ; Tue, 23 Dec 1997 14:02:29 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <349FE151.2973@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 16:05:38 +0000 From: Linda Bennett Reply-To: ag367@earthlink.net Organization: Great Plains Aircraft Supply Co. Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0-C-NSCP (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: krnet-l@teleport.com Subject: Re: KR: Prop Maker Phone Numbers References: <2.2.32.19971223164505.006bf614@pacbell.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ed sterba 414-728-1367 on vacation till the 1st. sb - --------------31DFF4F5237C228A2F1CF0FB-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:36:36 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: Re: Don Clarkes KR-2 Don, Congratulations! Send PictureS!! - -- Regards - -- Ross DClarke351 wrote: > > I just thouhgt I would drop you all a line to let you know that my KR-2 Tri- > Gear is just about finished and just about ready for FAA inspection here in El > Paso, Tx. I just finished the push rod system rigging. I will send more info > as time goes on. Ican be reached at DClarke351@aol.com or 915-755-0588. Don > Clarke - -- KRNET-L Administrator !!! REMEMBER POSTS GO TO !!! krnet@krnet.org !!! KRNET-L@teleport.com !!! rossy@teleport.com !!! NOT krnet@krnet.org !!! http://www.krnet.org ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 19:49:45 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Phoenix bound gang jeroffey wrote: > Ross dropped a note saying he was heading back to Oregon on the 26th so he > won't be stopping in.(If he calls you, twist him a little about the weather > in OR and how a couple more days in AZ would be good for him!) > Looking forward to meeting you guys! > John Roffey Not Fair! It was OVC weather in Phoenix on 12/22. BOO! (I had a cold so it didn't matter.) It was really nice on 12/26 however. Luv that Piper Cub! -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:03:34 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Progress Report and one question MARVIN MCCOY wrote: > ONE QUESTION: The plans show the control stick with a square > piece between the angle brackets that the stick bolts to and pivots on. > It is unclear what kind of bearings are used in this square tubing. Is > there another way of doing this. It seems like I could just use a bolt > inside a round tube and it would be easier and simpler to make. > Although I may need to devise a way to put a bolt through the side to > hang the stick with??? Anyone done this any different then the plans?? Marvin, I started to get the stick fabricated when I lived in Phoenix. You need to get a cylinder turned on the square piece so that you can press fit a bearing over it. I have such an animal someplace, but I never completed building up my stick, I just layed out the $150 or so to Rand Robinson after we got 40% into the project. I had a machinist where I work turn the piece. If I find it in the garage I will let you know. I didn't have a metal lathe to turn the stock, and I don't expect you do either... you will have to get it done probably. -- Ross > Or know a better way. Thanks > > Marvin McCoy > Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field > Mr.Marvin@worldnet.att.net ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 22:14:41 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR: Huntsville Gathering III Two or three guys wrote: > > ...we'll shoot for Jan. 24th if Mark's clear on that date. Sounds good to me. I'll haul the kids to Grandma's at about 10:00, and could meet you guys at Madison County Executive (M82) at 11:00 (CST). Call me at 205-851-9902 if you need to, or the cell phone at the last minute at 205-683-7895. We could eat lunch on the way to my house. Talked to Troy Petteway tonight, and he'd love to be here too. If we're lucky, Jim Hill will be in town, and we can check out his repair job to his KR. He missed the last Gathering due to a job related school he has been attending forever. And Randy, if I wanted to steal ALL of the faithful, I'd have mentioned the Booby Bungalo... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL email at langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project construction at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:14:47 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: First plane I talked to Jeff Scott about this via email a few times, and he has a wealth of information. I could paraphrase what he said, but it would be better to shoot him an email. -- Regards Ross Micheal Mims wrote: > > At 11:32 PM 12/22/97 -0500, you wrote: > Honest opinions would be appreciated...I'm not that porky so no BBQ's > >please. > > > >Thanks KRnet heads... > >Jeremy Casey jrcasey@mindspring.com > > > > > > Well I have heard Janette tell more than one person on the phone that she > does not recommend the KR for low time pilots. Based on the little time I > have in one I wouldn't either. I am sure you will get more input on this > from some of the other KR "Drivers", also send a email to Jeff Scott at: > jscott.pilot@juno.com and ask him. He is a current high time pilot with > aerobatic training. He has been flying his KR2 now for a few months and > will give you a good idea of what you could be in for. Jeff is no longer on > the KRnet so you will need to send a privet email to him. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Micheal Mims > Happy Holidays to Everyone! > > mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net > http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:41:59 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Nylaflow brake lines? Micheal Mims wrote: > > At 08:17 AM 12/28/97 -0600, you wrote: > >BrakeLineHeads, > > > >I seem to vaguely remember somebody saying that Nylaflow(R!) brake lines > >might melt if connected directly to the caliper, especially during extended > >taxi tests. Has anyone had this experience? > > This happened to a Defiant and she burned to the ground, I asked Brad about > it and he has nylaflow all the way to his brakes and has had no problems and > it shows no weird signs of melting after 500+ hours. Maybe on heavy > aircraft with large brakes there would be an issue but it seems with the > light brake applications its OK to use the plastic line to the caliper. I remember reading someplace that brakes on a taildragger were not really supposed to be used except occasionally on taxi... but there is always the fence at the end of the runway I guess. On my KR-2 I haven't modified my nylaflow tubing yet, but in my case the brake assembly is attached to a rather LARGE heat sink, that being the retract casting. I think this could dissipate a lot of heat. Also, the amount of energy being dissapated by the KR brakes is substantially less than that of a Defiant twin engine four place composite with (I'm expecting). But the idea is the same, hot brakes and plastic might not mix. -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:45:13 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: KR: Possible error in manual? Mike, I also heard of a KR on a hard landing where the top 5/8" crossmember pulled from the fuselage. The Tech counselor I chatted with suggested that tying the crossmember to the fuselage sides might be an alternative if I was really concerned about this. I opted to go with the plans which do include the T6 angle, but are not too clear about the length. - -- Ross MikeT nyc wrote: > > I was reading the plans for the upper engine mount installation (pg. 16, > drawing #9), when I noticed an error, or at least a difference from the > original suggestion in the Newsletters. The KR mount is narrower than the > KR-2 firewall and localizes the stress further from the longerons than > isideal. > > The use of a T6 aluminum angle iron behind the firewall began when Lance > Neibauer discovered cracks in the 5/8" spruce crossmember of his 175 hour > KR-2, and suggested reinforcement, which resulted in several months of > controversy (Newsletters # 97-99) after Rand Robinson denied there was a > problem and said Neibauer must have damage his plane by dropping it off a > trailer. > > Eventually, RR put the angle iron in the plans, but Niebauer's original > drawing also said to epoxy the angle to both the 5/8" crossmember and the top > 1/4" ply shear plate and bolt it to the shear plate. (It's already bolted to > the 5/8" by the engine mounts. Niebauer does not say how many or where to > bolt on the 1/4" ply, just that "8/32's are sufficient," but I guess you'd > bolt it where the engine mount bolts are). The drawing in the plans, by > contrast has the angle but nothing about bolts or epoxy, > > I'm sure we're all shocked to imagine that there might be an error in the > manual, but perhaps the unthinkable has finally happened. Seriously, does > anyone know whether the lack of epoxy and bolts to the shearplate in the > manual was developed because of problems that developed in the Niebauer > version, or would it be wise to add them? (The "problems" I'm thinking of > would be that aluminum expands and contract with temperature much differently > from spruce). > > Incidentally, as some of you may know, Lance Neibauer was once very active in > KR's before he lost the faith and began building some kind of knock-off plane > whose name I can't recall. . . . > > Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:48:22 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: I'm Back I'm back from vacation, and two hours of Piper Cub Dual time. Now I'm stoked up to get some more building done. BTW, Did I mention I got my Terra Transponder from Chief? I've got plenty of work to do... hopefully I will do some this week, and post some photos. -- Ross Now I'm off to play James Bond 007 on Nintendo64 with the kids... Happy New Year! -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Dec 1997 23:49:10 -0800 From: "Martin Mulvey" Subject: Re: KR: Possible error in manual? Hi there, In mine, I installed dowels at the upper and lower engine crossmounts, these will be beefed up as well with the 6061-T6 angles. Hope this helps. BRGDS Marty - -----Original Message----- From: Ross Youngblood To: KRNET Date: 28 December, 1997 20:47 Subject: Re: KR: Possible error in manual? >Mike, > I also heard of a KR on a hard landing where the top 5/8" crossmember >pulled from the fuselage. The Tech counselor I chatted with suggested >that tying the crossmember to the fuselage sides might be an alternative >if I was really concerned about this. I opted to go with the plans >which do include the T6 angle, but are not too clear about the length. > >-- Ross > > > > >MikeT nyc wrote: >> >> I was reading the plans for the upper engine mount installation (pg. 16, >> drawing #9), when I noticed an error, or at least a difference from the >> original suggestion in the Newsletters. The KR mount is narrower than the >> KR-2 firewall and localizes the stress further from the longerons than >> isideal. >> >> The use of a T6 aluminum angle iron behind the firewall began when Lance >> Neibauer discovered cracks in the 5/8" spruce crossmember of his 175 hour >> KR-2, and suggested reinforcement, which resulted in several months of >> controversy (Newsletters # 97-99) after Rand Robinson denied there was a >> problem and said Neibauer must have damage his plane by dropping it off a >> trailer. >> >> Eventually, RR put the angle iron in the plans, but Niebauer's original >> drawing also said to epoxy the angle to both the 5/8" crossmember and the top >> 1/4" ply shear plate and bolt it to the shear plate. (It's already bolted to >> the 5/8" by the engine mounts. Niebauer does not say how many or where to >> bolt on the 1/4" ply, just that "8/32's are sufficient," but I guess you'd >> bolt it where the engine mount bolts are). The drawing in the plans, by >> contrast has the angle but nothing about bolts or epoxy, >> >> I'm sure we're all shocked to imagine that there might be an error in the >> manual, but perhaps the unthinkable has finally happened. Seriously, does >> anyone know whether the lack of epoxy and bolts to the shearplate in the >> manual was developed because of problems that developed in the Niebauer >> version, or would it be wise to add them? (The "problems" I'm thinking of >> would be that aluminum expands and contract with temperature much differently >> from spruce). >> >> Incidentally, as some of you may know, Lance Neibauer was once very active in >> KR's before he lost the faith and began building some kind of knock-off plane >> whose name I can't recall. . . . >> >> Mike Taglieri > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 12:17:56 -0600 From: brian whatcott Subject: KR: Rash of NMACs News item fresh off Avweb's AvFlash service: (12/29/97) INVESTIGATORS EXAMINE SERIES OF SUSPICIOUS NMACS Investigators from the NTSB and the FAA are working together to determine the circumstances involving a curious spate of near mid-air collisions at various locations throughout the U.S. All of the reports - -- with some variations -- seem to involve an ungainly, previously unknown aircraft type featuring a single red anti-collision beacon, a row of antennae mounted atop an elongated nose, a bulky red fuselage and skids for landing gear. All reports received so far occurred the evening of December 24-25. > brian whatcott Altus OK ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 13:16:34 -0500 From: Tom Andersen Subject: Re: KR: Re: Don Clarkes KR-2 > DClarke351 wrote: > > > > I just thouhgt I would drop you all a line to let you know that my KR-2 Tri- > > Gear is just about finished and just about ready for FAA inspection here in El > > Paso, Tx. I just finished the push rod system rigging. I will send more info > > as time goes on. I can be reached at DClarke351@aol.com or 915-755-0588. Don > > Clarke Congratulations! You have accomplished what many kit purchasers never will: Completion! - -Tom ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 13:40:32 EST From: BSHADR Subject: KR: New KR Chicklette KRNetheads: While wading through some of my Emails of last week (600+!), I came across this note from Don. I don't think he is on KRNet (yet), but I'll see to informing him how too get on soonest. Anyone live close to him? Drop him a line. Randy Stein BSHADR@aol.com Soviet Monica, CA ~~~~~~~~~~~ Subj: Don Clarke KR-2 Date: 97-12-21 23:01:55 EST From: DClarke351 I thought you would be interested in this. I am just about to have my KR-2 Tri Gear ,Revmaster 2100 S hauled out to the airport her in El Paso Tx. (TX04) I have been working on it for just about 3 yrs now. It has been interesting. I hope it will live up to all the things I want it to do. (Like fly) I will be sending more information as time goes on and perhaps a picture or two. Don Clarke at DClarke351@aol.com or 915-755-0588 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 13:49:50 -0500 From: Tom Andersen Subject: KR: Linda Bennett Comment > Since I have been on the KR net, I am taken back by the negative > comments by many builders. The KR is not a new aircraft. It has been > around for 25 years. If you don't trust the plans, can't talk to > successful builders/flyers, why would you even consider building the > plane. The KR offers performance/ and reasonable price! Look at the > many/many KR aircraft that have been built successfully. Why be negative > about a plane that you want to spend X$ on, and years of your life > building.. If thats the case, maybe a BD is on your mind. Steve > Bennett I've been accused of being with the good old boy network, but > value has its place and the KR have value. What's a BD? Maybe these negative comments are coming from higher expectations than we should expect from a "value-oriented kit". If we're comparing a $7k kit like the KR-2 to a 15-25K kit like the Pulsar or Glasair, then we're comparing apples to watermelons. You get what you pay for. Now let's turn that apple into apple pie! With the aid of our fellow builders here on KR-Net we can put a scoop of ice cream on top! - -Tom In love with KR-2S but not RR ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 14:04:28 -0500 From: Tom Andersen Subject: Re: KR: Re: Possible error in manual? Mark Langford wrote: > I've always thought that if the engine mount were designed properly (with > the four firewall points connecting to the firewall within an inch or two > of the longerons) that it would be senseless to run that angle all the way > across. I'm just going to use about four inches of it at each location, > and I'll epoxy/flox it well, as well as bolting. I like the idea of using 90 degree or so metal brackets to tie the top cross-brace to the fuse sides. When you consider that six G's in a turn can multiply the engine's weight up to six times it's current weight, you could end up with 1000 lbs force on the firewall. If these brackets were tied to the angle piece all the way across the firewall, I would feel more confidence in the firewall. - -Tom ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 14:16:11 -0600 (CST) From: flesner Subject: KR: insurance Happy New Year fellow Netters, I just got off the phone with two insurance companies and was disappointed to say the least to find that neither one offers insurance coverage for the KR. AOPA simple stated that they don't insure EXPERMENTIAL and Avemco will offer liability only for property damage or injury to persons other than persons aboard the aircraft. For you builders or owners with completed and flying KR's, do you have insurance coverage for the KR and if so, what is the name of the company and a phone number if possible. Do any of you have hangers that you are insuring? Name and number there also please. Any info appreciated. Larry Flesner larryfle@midwest.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 16:08:15 EST From: BSHADR Subject: Re: KR: NLF Visionary fund at $820 In a message dated 97-12-26 15:27:19 EST, Steve wrote: << All donations to the NLF Visionary Fund are greatly appreciated and can be sent to: Steve Eberhart P.O. Box 9227 Evansville, IN 47724 >> Ahem...this is where a little whine can make the NLF experience all the better. Pleazzzzzze send your donation in. Similar to public radio and public TV, it depends on the goodness of the KRNetters to succeed. You all know that when (and if for the doubters) this venture pans out, most everyone will go to this new airfoil instead of the RAF48. Don't ride on someone elses dime - ante up you share. If Steve ends up with a shortage, some of us die hards will have to dig deep and make up the difference - THEN THE CRYING WILL REALLY START. Imagine me, the guy on the edge with the house money boss, 'splaining how I need to send more money to Steve (whom she doesn't know), for an NLF airfoil test (that she doesn't care about nor understand), so everyone in KRNetland will benefit! Talk about a "snowballs chance in h*ll." Plus my kid was home from school for the holidays and my pocket lettuce container is a bit wilted...don't get me started...do your part!!!! I'll crawl back into my hole now - direct all flames to the undersigned: Randy (Nomex) Stein BSHADR@aol.com Societ Monica, CA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 16:08:04 EST From: BSHADR Subject: KR: Nylaflow brake lines In a message dated 97-12-28 23:47:48 EST, as part of an ongoing discussion Ross wrote: < ...But the idea is the same, hot brakes and plastic might not mix. >> Netheads: If my memory serves me correctly (always suspect) our chapter tech counselor reminded some of us that Nylaflow is considered a 2 year product under normal use. If tends to get brittle from heat and ozone exposure and it has been known to split, spewing it's contents. He said that most cautious folks run the tubing Nylaflow tubing inside a larger alum "chase" so it can be replaced when it gets brittle. He said this as he was replacing his Nylaflow on his Long EZ gear legs and repairing said "major surgery" damage. He also suggested we include a short length of alum or SS tubing at the Nylaflow connection to the brake cylinders as a spacer/isolator to reduce heat transfer potential. We didn't need to ask him how he knew as we watched him doing the work. He is also an A&P, CFI and commuter capt'n in turbo props. I have lots of respect for his observations, however your mileage may vary... Randy Stein BSHADR@aol.com Soviet Monica, CA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 15:33:08 -0500 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: insurance flesner wrote: > I just got off the phone with two insurance companies and was > disappointed to say the least to find that neither one offers > insurance coverage for the KR. AOPA simple stated that they > don't insure EXPERMENTIAL and Avemco will offer liability > only for property damage or injury to persons other than > persons aboard the aircraft. > Larry Flesner > larryfle@midwest.net That is interesting, since the EAA, and I think AVEMCO also, have said that AVEMCO will insure an experimental from the first flight, including hull damage and all liability, if you get three inspections throughout the construction process from an EAA technical designee. You might try asking the EAA directly. The other option might be to get a general liability insurance policy that will pay off in addition to any other insurance that will cover you for anything, car accidents, home, walking around, etc. - -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 17:47:51 EST From: EagleGator Subject: Re: KR: insurance In a message dated 97-12-29 16:34:38 EST, you write: << flesner wrote: > I just got off the phone with two insurance companies and was > disappointed to say the least to find that neither one offers > insurance coverage for the KR. AOPA simple stated that they > don't insure EXPERMENTIAL and Avemco will offer liability > only for property damage or injury to persons other than > persons aboard the aircraft. > Larry Flesner > larryfle@midwest.net That is interesting, since the EAA, and I think AVEMCO also, have said that AVEMCO will insure an experimental from the first flight, including hull damage and all liability, if you get three inspections throughout the construction process from an EAA technical designee. You might try asking the EAA directly. The other option might be to get a general liability insurance policy that will pay off in addition to any other insurance that will cover you for anything, car accidents, home, walking around, etc. -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm >> I just talked to the EAA, they referred me to Avemco at (800) 638-8440, and I talked to Chris Thompson. I got the same story Larry did, but also got another point of contact. According to Chris, a guy named Jim Nelson, (800) 874-9125 makes the decision on what coverage is offered. I tried to reach Mr. Nelson, but only got to talk to his voice mail. I'm guessing that the safety/mishap record is such that they won't provide the coverage, but I want to hear it from the horse's mouth. They did offer me a $1,000,000 liability policy for $370 per year that covers everything but the airplane and its occupants -- such a deal. Cheers, Rick Junkin EagleGator@aol.com St. Charles MO ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 17:07:55 -0600 (CST) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: KR: NLF International Visionary Fund at $995 Wow, We have received donations from the United Kingdom and now Japan. THis is truly an international effort. Thanks guys we are getting there. THe latest donations have brought the total to $995. We still need your hel. The first wing with the NLF(1)0115 airfoil is ready for final contouring and should be ready for our scheduled January 5th time slot into the wind tunnel. There will be a second wind tunnel session to test the custom airfoil that Dr. Selig and his graduate students will be designing specifically for the KR-2S. The original $1000 will cover both wind tunnel sessions but I could use some help for materials. Each wing section takes about $180 in carbon fiber alone and I will have close to $400 invested in the first wing section. The first set of precision NLF effort but I hesitate to ask for a second set to be donated. We should at least be able to pay for materials, about $60 to $70. We are not only getting two wind tunnel sessions but a full blown stability analysis of the KR-2S design. The list of contributors to date: John Roffey (made and contributed the spars) Richard Mole (Great Briton) Tim Schuy (Japan) Brian Bland G.M. Lee Ross Youngblood Pat Flowers Randy Stein Robert Moreland Robert Cornelius John Esch Ronald Lee Mark Langford Oscar Zuniga Rex Ellington Troy Johnson Current plans are to have all of the names of the contributors engraved on the NLF wind tunnel wing and donate it to the EAA museum after we are done with it. THis is your chance to get your name in the EAA museum (assuming they accept it :-)) Steve ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 18:49:53 EST From: KR2 616TJ Subject: KR: Glass fuel tank? I'm still trying to decide whether to build a alum. or glass header tank, it's now time for the KRNet to make up my mind for me. If I build a glass tank, do I need to use 1" foam or can I get by with say 1/2" or 3/4" if I use baffles and attach them to the top and bottom of the tank? If I use 1", are baffles necessary? Remember this is only the header tank. Has anyone found a good, reliable and simple (I may be asking too much) sending unit? Give my a hand here guys. Dana Overall http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 19:23:12 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: Re: Glass fuel tank? Dana Overall wrote: > I'm still trying to decide whether to build a alum. or glass header tank, it's > now time for the KRNet to make up my mind for me. Dana, I used 1/4" Clark foam (4.5 lb density), with two layers of 6 oz cloth on each side. I could easily stand on it, maybe even jump up and down. I think you still need baffles to slow down fuel transfer which could surprise you during climbs or turns. I also used plain ole 2 lb urethane foam 3/8" thick for the top, as well as some other parts. Could probably use it all over with no problem. I only used Clark because I had some laying around. I bought the Mitchell (VDO) sending unit from Wicks. After putting it on a diet, it went from 19.8 oz to 2.3! Pictures are on my project update at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford/kmarkl.html . I've never seen a VDO sender fail, in my 25 years of driving nothing but German cars, but I'm sure it happens. Do like Michael Mims did and leave it easily accessible (see his page for details). Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL email at langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project construction at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V1 #201 *****************************