From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 1998 5:04 AM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V2 #59 krnet-l-digest Wednesday, March 25 1998 Volume 02 : Number 059 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 23:23:54 -0600 From: Bobby Muse Subject: Re: KR: Sun and Fun At 05:22 AM 3/21/98 +0000, you wrote: >If there would be enough interest, we would be glad to host an Airport >BBQ for KR folks at our trailer on April 20 after the display buildings >close at 5:00 pm. We travel with a grill and could furnish hot dogs, >polish sausage etc... brewskies and pop. Steve > I'll be there... Bobby Muse(N122B) bmuse@mindspring.com Wimberly, TX ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 00:51:00 EST From: EagleGator Subject: KR: More Gathering Stuff Hi gang, it's me again. I'm going to check on getting some materials donated for our demonstration seminars. Let me know what materials you need, and I'll start canvassing. Mark, you're on for the composite demo. Did I mention that most folks want a demo on how to use vinyl ester? Just kidding.... sort of. Actually, if someone wants to pick up the ball, it would be cool to simultaneously demonstrate layups with both Aero Poxy (or equivalent) and vinyl ester, with two crews working at the same time. Any takers? Brian Bland volunteered to do a vacuum bagging demo, what kind of resin do you want to use, Brian? Tom, thanks for volunteering for the flymart. No problem with getting you to the composite demo, we should have plenty of volunteers to cover it (hint, hint). Oscar, go ahead and ask the folks at MacAlister (sp?) if they are interested in showing off their equipment, there are quite a few folks considering Subarus. Let me know what they say. By the way, I'm just the electronic relay man for Don Betchan. I'm feeding him your ideas, and he is pointing us in the appropriate direction. Randy Stein broke ground last year with alot of the ideas we are using again this year, so my work is mainly in polishing an already clean product. Just keep feeding ideas and volunteering, folks! Cheers! Rick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 21:58:18 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Re: straight sides At 08:41 PM 3/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >Why do you thing they are angled in the plans? I'm sure it wasnt thrown in just to do compound angles on the crossmembers. > > Who knows? Maybe a carry over from the Taylor plans or Ken thought it looked too square with straight sides. I sat and tried to envision my project with flat sides last night and I am happy with the bottom being a little narrower. On the other hand the Dragonfly starts off with flat sides but with the nice rounded bottom and nicely blended turtledeck you would never know it. I don't think there is any structural or aerodynamic advantages to doing it either way. I do know there are aerodynamic advantages to having a nice rounded fuselage on the top and bottom though. I gave serious thought to adding 3 inch foam to the bottom of my fuselage so I could have rounded corners like they did on the WAR replicas but decided the advantages may not be worth the weight. I did however add 3 inch foam to the bottom of the fuselage forward of the wing. This allowed me to round the fuselage where it seems to be most important (in front of the wing) and to build a nice cooling air exit. It also covered up the dramatic curve at the bottom longeron from just under the wing to the firewall. This seems to be a funky area on the KR that just doesn't allow for a nice cowling fit up. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area 51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims mirror site at : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Mar 98 13:08:25 CST From: "dboll" Subject: Re: KR: Sun and Fun I will be at Lakeland the 19th 20th 21st. and Iwill be staying at the Bud= getel on 301. I will be glad to bring beverages or what ever.Looking forw= ard to seeing some kr gyus I was at Perry, Oshkosh, Lakeland last year = and had a great time. See you all there. Don Boll ND - ---------- > At 05:22 AM 3/21/98 +0000, you wrote: > >If there would be enough interest, we would be glad to host an Airport > >BBQ for KR folks at our trailer on April 20 after the display building= s > >close at 5:00 pm. We travel with a grill and could furnish hot dogs, > >polish sausage etc... brewskies and pop. Steve > > > > I'll be there... > > Bobby Muse(N122B) > bmuse@mindspring.com > Wimberly, TX > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 22:54:23 -0800 From: Douglas Dorfmeier Subject: Re: KR: Fwd: VW conversion [Able Exp Aircraft Engines] Mike Sharkey wrote: > > Hey guys, > Got the following reply from Able Experimental Aircraft Engines. Anyone live > in the Fort Walton Beach Florida area that could go and witness one of these > motors on the dyno and report back? These are the guys claiming to be getting > 100HP@3000RPM for a normally asperated 2.1 litre VW motor > (http://www.altimizer.com/engine_specs.html). After I wrote them as a > non-believer, they're offering to run one up on the dyno with witnesses..... > > Mike Sharkey > X11 Development > SoftArc Inc. > http://www.softarc.com/~msharkey > > ----- clipity clip ---- > > Dear Mike: > First of all, I wish to clarify that we do not build VW conversions. > Our engines are assembled from new components, many of which are custom > manufactured. Our engines are purpose-built for home-built/experimental > aircraft use. > One of the means we utilize to achieve the higher horsepower output is > to reach far in excess of 100% volumetric efficiency at a specific area of > the power band useful for turning a propeller of a reasonable diameter. > This is achieved in part by matching all the various dimensions of engine > parts (valve diameter, valve lift, engine timing, ignition timing, etc.) so > they work as a system and each compliment power output. For example, we > have found that a properly sized induction manifold can do amazing things > when the other various components are properly sized and matched to it. In > our engines, the power band is very limited and is short. The horsepower > and torque curve climb rapidly, whereas the torque curve peaks at around > 2700 or 2800 rpm's and then starts to fall off sharply. The horsepower > curve continues to climb until it peaks at around 3200 and then it starts > to go downhill quite rapidly. The ram-induction affect has run its course. > To arrive at the best values/dimensions to incorporate into our > engines, we use some very expensive software which have made the > construction of such more-powerful-than-usual engines. Without such tools > I would have never known or believed that such was possible. A > trial-and-error technique of R&D to arrive at the same results would have > been futile as well as cost and time prohibititive. > I stand by my claims and am willing to perform a dyno test with my > Land and Sea dynometer, with audience. > Sincerely yours, > > Ron Eubanks > ---------- > > ----- clipity clip ---- Mike, This engines sounds interesting. How far is this guy located from Sun n Fun or Orlando. I will be going ot Sun n Fun but staying in Orlando and might be able to see this guy. I wonder if he will displaying at Sun n Fun. Maybe he could do a demo there. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 02:11:12 EST From: MikeT nyc Subject: Re: KR: ELT antenna? >> Also, has anybody ever been told at inspection that their ELT mounting >> wasn't up to par? This one says mount to something that won't break with >> 100 lbs of force exerted in the flimsiest direction. > >This sounds over-designed. The idea of an ELT is to go off in a >surviable accident. If your elt weights about one pound, you are >looking at about 100g's of deaccelation. 20-40g's is about the upper >limit. > >The other point I can offer is that the ELT is not required until you >leave the test area. You can avoid putting it in until have your 40 >hours flown off. In January, I sent this list a modification from Rand Robinson suggested in the Newsletter for shoulder harnesses, where they said that increasing the thickness of the shelf above the seat from 3/32" to 1/4" plywood and installing doublers to connect it to the top longerons would result in an assembly that could withstand 4000lbs in a crash -- 25% more than the weight ot two 200 lb persons in a 20 G collision. One wonders why the ELT needs to sustain a 40 G collision and the passengers only a 20 G (maybe for quick recovery of the bodies while they're still fresh?), but I would think a 1/4" section of flooring with reinforcements to the bottom longerons would give equivalent strength for your ELT mounting. Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 06:35:42 -0500 From: "Richard Parker" Subject: Re: KR: Double checking >I went to 39 1/2 and 34 1/2 on the firewall I went 44 inchs on the width >and the Instrument Panel fit in just right. I flew a Grumman last weekend >and I am thinking about going with the >Grumman windshield and I think it will fit Wag-Aero has it for 199.50 >dollar. > Terry Chizek > Marion Kansas Thats what we were thinking. Austin Clark checked into it. its pretty wide. The price is right even if it has to be cut back substantially. Richard Parker Jaffrey, NH theparkers@monad.net http://top.monad.net/~theparkers/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 08:45:10 -0500 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Double checking Richard Parker wrote: > > To all you guys out there with widened fuselages did you still > maintain the same width at the firewall? Yes, but if I had to do it again, I would make the firewall about 2 inches taller and get a better line of curvature along the bottom surface. - -- Don Reid Bumpass, Va. mailto:donreid@erols.com KR2XL at http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm Ultralights at http://www.erols.com/donreid/usua250.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 16:36:36 +0100 From: Michele Bucceri Subject: Re: KR: firewall Richard Parker wrote: > > >To all you guys out there with widened fuselages did you still > maintain the same width at the firewall? > > The reason I'm asking is because i'd like to stretch the width out to > at least 42" and move the widest point back to the trailing edge ( > i.e. Langford). I'm ready to put my sides together and am not real > sure how much stretch I can get. Also if I leave the firewall stock > I'll get more wetted area in front (drag) therefore I figured if I > widen the firewall the wetted are will stay relatively the same as per > plans. > > Since most of you probably either widened or thought about it, are > there any obvious things I'm overlooking? > > (All this just so I can fit a $11.95 prepunched instrument panel seems > a little kooky) > > See what agony you've caused me Austin! > > Richard Parker > Jaffrey, NH > theparkers@monad.net > http://top.monad.net/~theparkers/ > > > > Richard, I'm widening my fuselage to some 41". I've considered moving the widest point back to the shulders, but I prefer to have more room for my elbows than for my shoulders. Don't know if this is the right choice, and I'm building a fuselage mock-up to check it. In any case, as usual, I think it's a matter of personal preference. Ciao, Michele ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:45:15 -0500 From: msharkey@softarc.com (Mike Sharkey) Subject: KR: Re: Able Exp Aircraft Engines From a keyboard far far away owner-krnet-l@teleport.com pecks: >Mike, > >This engines sounds interesting. How far is this guy located from Sun n >Fun or Orlando. I will be going ot Sun n Fun but staying in Orlando and >might be able to see this guy. I wonder if he will displaying at Sun n >Fun. Maybe he could do a demo there. Well, looking on the map, Ft Walton Beach appears to be located near the north west "corner" of Florida, it appears to be quite far from Orlando. I'm trying to find out if they (AEAE) intend to be present at any of the events this year, in particular, Sun n Fun. Mike Sharkey X11 Development SoftArc Inc. http://www.softarc.com/~msharkey ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 11:11:22 -0600 (CST) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: KR: Have my PerryKosh reservations Just made my hotel reservations for PerryKosh. Arriving Thursday 17 Sept leaving Sunday. Still have the unused Southwest Airlines ticket from last year, was in the hospital with a kidney stone, and will be flying into OKC. I will have a rental car if anyone needs a ride to Perry. Baggage space will be a little restricted as I will have one of the NLF airfoil wind tunnel wings with me so all that have contributed to the NLF project can see the results of their contributions. Current plans are still to have the names of the contributors engraved on the wing section and donate it to the EAA museum. Steve Eberhart newtech@newtech.com http://www.newtech.com/nlf ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 98 18:06:35 GMT From: mathewrz@iafrica.com (Rob Matthews) Subject: KR: Fiberglass upside down Hi All I wish i were over there to be able to attend Sun And Fun. Has anyone done fiberglassing upside down. I smashed my elevator on the r/hand side and had to cut a piece out as if i were doing the trim tab but then having to fill it in again with new foam and then fiberglass. The foam part was easy, but the fiberglass side was where all the swear words were flying. I have finally done it and will have to wait until it dries. Use 10 eyes when wheeling your plane into the garage as i didn't and went into the wall. Question time ????? Has anyone had the retract gear and then converted to the fixed gear (Dan Dheil) conversion. I am wanting to know how one mounts the plate onto the spar without cutting up your inboard wing section to do the drilling into the spar. Any comments are welcome!!! Many Thanks - -- Rob Matthews Have a nice day South Africa email mathewrz@iafrica.com KR 2 ZS-VCM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 98 18:10:25 GMT From: mathewrz@iafrica.com (Rob Matthews) Subject: KR: End stages Hi All Does the work on these planes ever come to an end. It seems that you take one step forward and then two backwards. I know how Ross feels when you find something new each time to do. But it is fun and watching the video from video Bob makes more and more determined to complete and start flying. Cheers for now - -- Rob Matthews Have a nice day South Africa email mathewrz@iafrica.com KR 2 ZS-VCM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:08:51 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Fiberglass upside down At 06:06 PM 3/24/98 GMT, you wrote: >I am wanting to know how one mounts the plate onto the spar >without cutting up your inboard wing section to do the drilling into the spar. >Any comments are welcome!!! >Many Thanks You will have to cut up your stub wing airfoils if you want to convert to the DD Gear. Maybe the RR Aluminum spring bar may be a better conversion? It mounts in the existing holes in the main spar. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims Mirror site at: http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 14:08:01 -0600 From: robert k adams Subject: Re: KR: Fiberglass upside down At 06:06 PM 3/24/98 GMT, you wrote: >Hi All > >I wish i were over there to be able to attend Sun And Fun. Has anyone done >fiberglassing upside down. I smashed my elevator on the r/hand side and had to >cut a piece out as if i were doing the trim tab but then having to fill it in >again with new foam and then fiberglass. The foam part was easy, but the >fiberglass side was where all the swear words were flying. I have finally done >it and will have to wait until it dries. Use 10 eyes when wheeling your plane >into the garage as i didn't and went into the wall. >Question time ????? >Has anyone had the retract gear and then converted to the fixed gear (Dan >Dheil) conversion. I am wanting to know how one mounts the plate onto the spar >without cutting up your inboard wing section to do the drilling into the spar. >Any comments are welcome!!! >Many Thanks >-- >Rob Matthews Have a nice day >South Africa >email mathewrz@iafrica.com >KR 2 ZS-VCM >hi there i went to sears and bought a looooong 1/4 inch drill bit then figure out your angle etc and drill thru wing then spar then patch the small hole. worked for me. bob adams <7057v> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 12:14:21 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: End stages At 06:10 PM 3/24/98 GMT, you wrote: >Hi All > >Does the work on these planes ever come to an end. It seems that you take one >step forward and then two backwards.>> Well that could be a reflection of how much stuff you have in your project. I plan to have a little as possible (to be legal) and that should help quite a bit towards getting in the air sooner. Heck if I lived at an uncontrolled airport I wouldn't even have a radio! Unfortunately I will need a very small electrical system to run the radio and transponder. I really wish I didn't have to purchase these multi thousand dollar pieces of equipment but what other options do I have? :o) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims Mirror site at: http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 17:56:21 From: Austin Clark Subject: Re: KR: Double checking At 22:33 3/23/98 -0600, you wrote: >I went to 39 1/2 and 34 1/2 on the firewall I went 44 inchs on the width >and the Instrument Panel fit in just right. I flew a Grumman last weekend >and I am thinking about going with the >Grumman windshield and I think it will fit Wag-Aero has it for 199.50 >dollar. > Terry Chizek > Marion Kansas Terry, I wanted to use the Wag Aero windshield also, but when I called them, they told me it was 64" wide. Now I am wondering if they gave me the wrong dimension. I would be interested if you find out different because I would like to use it and build a sliding canopy. Austin Clark Pascagoula, MS itac@datasync.com http://www.datasync.com/~itac/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 17:37:46 -0600 From: Bobby Muse Subject: Re: KR: Re: straight sides At 09:58 PM 3/23/98 -0800, you wrote: >At 08:41 PM 3/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >>Why do you thing they are angled in the plans? I'm sure it wasnt thrown in >just to do compound angles on the crossmembers. >> >Who knows? Maybe a carry over from the Taylor plans or Ken thought it >looked too square with straight sides. I sat and tried to envision my >project with flat sides last night and I am happy with the bottom being a >little narrower. On the other hand the Dragonfly starts off with flat sides >but with the nice rounded bottom and nicely blended turtledeck you would >never know it. I don't think there is any structural or aerodynamic >advantages to doing it either way. I do know there are aerodynamic >advantages to having a nice rounded fuselage on the top and bottom though. >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >Micheal Mims > Micheal, FYI In our case(KR/Dragonfly), I don't know if it makes much difference but when I worked at Lockheed in Marietta, GA., it was determined that the fuselage of the the C5A produce several thousand pounds of lift by itself. Just food for thought! Bobby Muse(N122B) bmuse@mindspring.com Wimberly, TX ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 17:56:46 -0600 From: Bobby Muse Subject: Re: KR: Fiberglass upside down At 06:06 PM 3/24/98 GMT, you wrote: >Hi All > >I wish i were over there to be able to attend Sun And Fun. Has anyone done >fiberglassing upside down. I smashed my elevator on the r/hand side and had to >cut a piece out as if i were doing the trim tab but then having to fill it in >again with new foam and then fiberglass. The foam part was easy, but the >fiberglass side was where all the swear words were flying. I have finally done >it and will have to wait until it dries. Use 10 eyes when wheeling your plane >into the garage as i didn't and went into the wall. >Question time ????? >Has anyone had the retract gear and then converted to the fixed gear (Dan >Dheil) conversion. I am wanting to know how one mounts the plate onto the spar >without cutting up your inboard wing section to do the drilling into the spar. >Any comments are welcome!!! >Many Thanks >-- >Rob Matthews Have a nice day >South Africa >email mathewrz@iafrica.com >KR 2 ZS-VCM > > Rob, You will need to cut into your inboard wing section in order to install the fixed gear conversion. Bobby Muse(N122B) bmuse@mindspring.com Wimberly, TX ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 18:51:38 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Re: straight sides At 05:37 PM 3/24/98 -0600, you wrote: >Micheal, FYI In our case(KR/Dragonfly), I don't know if it makes much >difference but when I worked at Lockheed in Marietta, GA., it was >determined that the fuselage of the the C5A produce several thousand pounds >of lift by itself. > > Just food for thought! > > > Yep it would be interesting to have wind tunnel test results of the KR just to see how much lift the fuselage creates at cruise speed. I think someone once said the Dragonfly fuselage produces almost 200 pounds of lift at cruise. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area 51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims mirror site at : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 22:02:37 -0500 From: Tom Andersen Subject: Re: KR: End stages Micheal Mims wrote: > > At 06:10 PM 3/24/98 GMT, you wrote: > >Hi All > > > >Does the work on these planes ever come to an end. It seems that you take one > >step forward and then two backwards.>> > > Well that could be a reflection of how much stuff you have in your project. > I plan to have a little as possible (to be legal) and that should help quite > a bit towards getting in the air sooner. Heck if I lived at an uncontrolled > airport I wouldn't even have a radio! Unfortunately I will need a very > small electrical system to run the radio and transponder. I really wish I > didn't have to purchase these multi thousand dollar pieces of equipment but > what other options do I have? :o) > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Micheal Mims > Proud Member of the Area51 BBA > > mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net > http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims > Mirror site at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ > Fax 714.856.9417 I have heard that if your plane was manufactured without an eletrical system you did not need a transponder in your plane to fly within the Mode C curtain. An FAA air traffic controller once told me that this applies to electrical systems on type certified aircraft only, and that the lighting coil or alternator on an experimental aircraft did not count as an electrical system. So I'll be saving a few grand. Of course if I want to fly into a controlled field I may need the hardware. I believe the purpose of this rule was to insure that the huge numbers of spam cans would be forced to maintain transponders, yet not constrain the existing fleet of hand-propped planes. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:03:21 -0600 (CST) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: Re: KR: Re: straight sides On Tue, 24 Mar 1998, Micheal Mims wrote: > At 05:37 PM 3/24/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Micheal, FYI In our case(KR/Dragonfly), I don't know if it makes much > >difference but when I worked at Lockheed in Marietta, GA., it was > >determined that the fuselage of the the C5A produce several thousand pounds > >of lift by itself. > > > > Just food for thought! > > > > > > > Yep it would be interesting to have wind tunnel test results of the KR just > to see how much lift the fuselage creates at cruise speed. I think someone > once said the Dragonfly fuselage produces almost 200 pounds of lift at cruise. I am still planning on building a giant scale radio control KR-2S. Next time I talk to Ashok I will see if it would be possible to run the fuselage through the wind tunnel. I don't even want to think what the stinger is going to be to build but it must be able to be done. Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 22:01:10 -0800 From: darrin Subject: KR: tail feathers Hello fellow kr junkies, Finally I got around to glassing the tail of my kr-1 using 5.85oz cloth and ez poxy. I very thick micro'd the dipps and gaps, simi-thick micro'd over the entire foam area(bottom) and laid on the cloth. Wet it out with epoxy to fill in the weave and removed the excess. Two days later I done the same on the top overlapping the bottom about 2". The job looks great but here is the question... On the two layers of cloth, do I sand over the first layer and epoxy the second layer over it or should I have laid them both together? Thanks, Darrin west KR-1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 22:45:39 -0600 From: "Terry Chizek" Subject: Re: KR: Double checking Austin that don t sound right the guy i went flying with is going to get me the dimension of his AA1 grumman next time he gos flying and I lett you know Terry Chizek - ---------- > > > I wanted to use the Wag Aero windshield also, but when I called them, they > told me it was 64" wide. Now I am wondering if they gave me the wrong > dimension. I would be interested if you find out different because I would > like to use it and build a sliding canopy. > > > Austin Clark > Pascagoula, MS > itac@datasync.com > http://www.datasync.com/~itac/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:19:14 -0800 From: MARVIN MCCOY Subject: KR: Tail feather balance Has anyone ever heard of a KR developing flutter in the elevator or rudder?? The plans only show the ailerons being balanced. I was thinking of balancing the elevator. But if it is not needed it would save about three pounds in the tail. I am not sure if the plans do not balance the elevator and rudder because they do not need it or maybe they were never blanced to just save weight in the tail. I don't know? I wonder if the rudder and elevator was ever analyzed to determine if balancing is needed?? All of the newsletters I have read have not mentioned any KRs that developed flutter in the elevator or rudder. It would be nice if balancing is not needed. Marvin McCoy Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field mr.marvin@worldnet.att.net - ---------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 00:34:34 EST From: MikeT nyc Subject: Re: KR: End stages >Heck if I lived at an uncontrolled >airport I wouldn't even have a radio! Unfortunately I will need a very >small electrical system to run the radio and transponder. I really wish I >didn't have to purchase these multi thousand dollar pieces of equipment but >what other options do I have? Actually, Terra transponders in particular draw so little current that you could run one for a weekend of flying on a 10 amp motorcycle battery, and shutting it off when you get out of controlled areas could stretch that use to weeks. Add a little handheld nav-com and you're in business. Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:22:40 -0700 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: KR: Re:: Fiberglass upside down Hi Rob, You can glass stuff upside down, but it isn't easy. There are a couple of methods you can try. (1) Mix a hot fast setting batch of Vinylester resin, so it will begin setting very quickly while you are working with it. You may end up with voids you might have to inject resin into later or some very rough areas depending on the size of the repair. Small repairs will stick just fine with Vinylester as it is much stickier than epoxy. If you are patching over epoxy, make sure the epoxy resin skin has been well roughed up. (2) Lay your patch in some heavy plastic and wrap or tape it up tight to the area to be repaired. There are many ways to support the glass up onto the bottom of a surface from underneath. The plastic will easily peel away after the glass is set. You can install the Deihl type gear legs without getting cutting away too much of the wing stub. You will need to cut about a 4x6 to 6x6 inch hole in front of the spar to give you room enough to get in to drill the spar with an angle drill. You an easily cover this area with an aluminum or fiberglass inspection panel. Since the bottom of the wing is relatively flat, it makes for an easy panel to make. You will also need a second hole behind the spar for installing the washers and nuts. It can be much smaller (3x3 inches). Just big enough for you to get your hands up inside. In some of the old KR Gathering videos of the first Diehl gear, there is a picture of Marty Roberts KR with the inspection panels on the bottom. I don't know if he has since glassed them in. Regards, Jeff Scott - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm On Tue, 24 Mar 98 18:06:35 GMT mathewrz@iafrica.com (Rob Matthews) writes: >Hi All > >I wish i were over there to be able to attend Sun And Fun. Has anyone done >fiberglassing upside down. I smashed my elevator on the r/hand side >and had to >cut a piece out as if i were doing the trim tab but then having to fill it in >again with new foam and then fiberglass. The foam part was easy, but the >fiberglass side was where all the swear words were flying. I have finally done >it and will have to wait until it dries. Use 10 eyes when wheeling your plane >into the garage as i didn't and went into the wall.Question time ????? >Has anyone had the retract gear and then converted to the fixed gear (Dan >Dheil) conversion. I am wanting to know how one mounts the plate onto >the spar >without cutting up your inboard wing section to do the drilling into the spar. >Any comments are welcome!!! >Many Thanks >-- >Rob Matthews Have a nice day >South Africa >email mathewrz@iafrica.com >KR 2 ZS-VCM > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 22:31:02 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: tail feathers At 10:01 PM 3/24/98 -0800, you wrote: >The job looks great but here is the question... On the two layers of >cloth, do I sand over the first layer and epoxy the second layer over it >or should I have laid them both together?>>> Well you should do all the layups together but if you scuff sand the first layer you should be able to weyout another layer on top of the first one.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area 51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims mirror site at : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 22:35:55 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: End stages At 12:34 AM 3/25/98 EST, you wrote: >Actually, Terra transponders in particular draw so little current that you >could run one for a weekend of flying on a 10 amp motorcycle battery, and >shutting it off when you get out of controlled areas could stretch that use to >weeks. Add a little handheld nav-com and you're in business. > >Mike Taglieri > Good idea but it still doesn't get me around the thousands of dollars required! :o) What's the current price on the Terra transponder these days? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Proud Member of the Area 51 BBA mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims mirror site at : http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Fax 714.856.9417 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 00:01:49 -0800 From: "Martin Mulvey" Subject: KR: Re: Tail feather balance Hi Marvin, I haven't heard any reports and the KR2 I flew was not showing any flutter at all. All the best! Marty - -----Original Message----- From: MARVIN MCCOY To: KR Net Date: 24 March, 1998 21:25 Subject: KR: Tail feather balance >Has anyone ever heard of a KR developing flutter in the elevator or >rudder?? The plans only show the ailerons being balanced. I was >thinking of balancing the elevator. But if it is not needed it would >save about three pounds in the tail. > I am not sure if the plans do not balance the elevator and rudder >because they do not need it or maybe they were never blanced to just >save weight in the tail. I don't know? I wonder if the rudder and >elevator was ever analyzed to determine if balancing is needed?? > All of the newsletters I have read have not mentioned any KRs that >developed flutter in the elevator or rudder. It would be nice if >balancing is not needed. > >Marvin McCoy >Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field >mr.marvin@worldnet.att.net >---------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:48:12 +0100 From: Michele Bucceri Subject: Re: KR: Re: straight sides Bobby Muse wrote: > > > Micheal, FYI In our case(KR/Dragonfly), I don't know if it makes much > difference but when I worked at Lockheed in Marietta, GA., it was > determined that the fuselage of the the C5A produce several thousand pounds > of lift by itself. > > Just food for thought! > > Bobby Muse(N122B) > bmuse@mindspring.com > Wimberly, TX No surprise: did you ever ask why when performing aerodinamic & performance evaluation, the wing area take account of the portion inside fuselage, and the span is measured tip to tip? This is exactly to take acount of the fuselage lift. So, to make brutal evaluation of the fuselage lift, you can consider it as a piece of wing having area equal to the virtual wing area inside the fuselage. Ciao, Michele - -- MBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMB Michele Bucceri E-mail: mailto:michele.bucceri@italtel.it MBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMBMB ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 03:46:31 -0500 From: "Driessen, Marcel" Subject: KR: Great Plains Long Block Kit Hello KRNetters, I'm thinking of buying a Great Plains Type 1 2180 cc Long Block Kit. I would appreciate if anybody who already assembled a GP Long Block Kit could share some experiences ? (For example: Total assembly time , Required skills, Quality of the Parts) Thanks, Marcel Driessen KR2S-Builder (boat on wheels, seats installed, starting with turtledeck construction) Meerlo, Limburg, The Netherlands e-mail: driessen@krohne.mhs.compuserve.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 04:28:51 -0500 From: "Driessen, Marcel" Subject: KR: Exhaust systems Hello KRNetters, Again a question from Holland. Can somebody tell me what differences in performance I can expect between a 2-into-1 cross over or a 4-into-1 Exhaust system on a VW-conversion ? Which one would be preferable on a KR2S (taildragger) ? Thanks, Marcel Driessen KR2S-Builder (boat on wheels, seats installed, starting with turtledeck construction) Meerlo, Limburg, The Netherlands e-mail: driessen@krohne.mhs.compuserve.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 05:10:18 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: Terra transponder price MIke Mims wrote: > Good idea but it still doesn't get me around the thousands of dollars > required! :o) What's the current price on the Terra transponder these days? $1300, + another $180 for an encoder, + $100 for the tray... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL email at langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project construction at http://fly.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 12:15:46 -0800 From: Alessandro Pecorara Subject: Re: KR: PT-ZMJ Rogerio Werneck wrote: > I have just joined the list and I hope some of you can help me. > Does anyone know the name/address/fone of PT-ZMJ builder ? or where i > could get it ? > I got many interesting informations from Mr. Macedo. His address is: Agliberto Fernandes de Macedo Rua Alexandre Fleming, 106 Guaratinguetà - SP 12500-000 Tel/fax: (012)522-4278 Saluti, Alessandro ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 07:27:14 EST From: KR2 616TJ Subject: Re: KR: Great Plains Long Block Kit In a message dated 98-03-25 03:54:23 EST, you write: << I'm thinking of buying a Great Plains Type 1 2180 cc Long Block Kit. I would appreciate if anybody who already assembled a GP Long Block Kit could share some experiences ? (For example: Total assembly time , Required skills, Quality of the Parts) >> Marcel, I just recently upgraded my 1835 to 2180 using the upgrade kit from Steve. As I used another case and had my own heads, cam and rods I cannot comment on the quality of these parts.....but, the parts I got from GPAS (crank(scat), cylinders, pistons, rings, force one bearing, etc., were some of the best quality engine parts I have encountered. I don't think you would be disappointed. Check with Mark Langford concerning the heads, valves and the rockers, he's got some great ideas on these. Steve quotes a time of 12 hours to assemble, I think I spent that much time cleaning everything, but then again I'm not in the "producton mode". I think you will find it is an extremely easy engine to assemble, just take your time and make sure of your torques and clearance checks. vdub forever!!!! I'm ducking again. Waiting for Sun & Fun!!! Dana Overall Richmond, KY kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 05:04:17 PST From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR: Tail feather balance Hi, Marvin You wrote: >All of the newsletters I have read have not mentioned any KRs that >developed flutter in the elevator or rudder. I don't have the old newsletters at the moment, but there was an accident report (fatal) where flutter was suspected. As I recall, the KR in question was doing a show pass, and was exceeding 230 or 240. Again, I am just going by vague memory. The plane sort of disintegrated, from the reports. As I understand it, that's what flutter does- just gets out of control in split-seconds. If you Vne your bird accordingly, and/or even partially balance, I guess it would put flutter out of reach; otherwise, IMHO- when you get out into the 200+ range, it would be wise to balance. Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V2 #59 ****************************