From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 11 Sep 2000 00:28:40 -0000 Issue 88 Date: Sunday, September 10, 2000 4:31 PM krnet Digest 11 Sep 2000 00:28:40 -0000 Issue 88 Topics (messages 1965 through 1979): Re: gathering 1965 by: Jim Faughn 1968 by: w.g. kirkland 1971 by: terry Corvair on a KR2 1966 by: Mark Langford 1974 by: Mark Langford 1977 by: Mike Mims sealed lead acid batteries 1967 by: Mark Langford Great Joy 1969 by: w.g. kirkland 1970 by: Lon V Boothby Back at it!!! 1972 by: Mark Jones Re: Prop size 1973 by: JEAN VERON 1976 by: macwood Was not MSI 1975 by: Eduardo Iglesias Re: cowling mold 1978 by: Peter Nauta Re: cowling mold/wing skins 1979 by: Mark Langford Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 17:56:58 -0500 To: "KR Net Response" From: "Jim Faughn" Subject: Re: KR> gathering Message-ID: I am planning on going down on Thursday morning. Plan to be there by lunch or so depending on weather. Let me know if you will be in the area. ---- You wrote: Would like to join anyone who is flying to the gathering thursday or friday. I will be flying my Kr2 from Marion Kansas. I could join up with anyone flying through Kansas or Missouri. TERRY CHIZEK CHITL@SOUTHWIND,NET Jim Faughn 4323D Laclede Ave. St. Louis, MO 63108 (314) 652-7659 mailto:jfaughn@mvp.net N891JF ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 00:15:41 -0400 To: , , From: "w.g. kirkland" Subject: Re: KR> gathering Message-ID: <005001c01a14$9ede22c0$d0905bd1@kirkland> I anticipate arriving Jackson Wed. and flying to the gathering Thur. morning. Driving my trusty C-150 W.G.(Bill) KIRKLAND kirkland@vianet.on.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, September 08, 2000 9:31 AM Subject: Re: KR> gathering > In a message dated 9/7/00 9:45:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > chitl@southwind.net writes: > > << who is flying to the gathering thursday or > friday. >> > I plan to fly from Michigan on friday and would also like to know who is > flying from where. If everyone commented prehaps others could make simular > plans > > Orma N110LR > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 00:43:07 -0500 To: , "KR Net Response" From: "terry" Subject: Re: KR> gathering Message-Id: <200009090544.e895iKf23168@sard.southwind.net> I am planning on going down on Thursday morning. Plan to be there by lunch > or so depending on weather. Let me know if you will be in the area. > > ---- You wrote: > Would like to join anyone who is flying to the gathering thursday or > friday. I will be flying my Kr2 from Marion Kansas. I could join up with > anyone flying through Kansas or Missouri. TERRY > CHIZEK CHITL@SOUTHWIND,NET > > Jim Faughn > 4323D Laclede Ave. > St. Louis, MO 63108 > (314) 652-7659 > mailto:jfaughn@mvp.net > N891JF Jim about 9:00 or 10:00am thursday about the best I can get there in and my kr2 flys at 135 mph and I have too meet you outside of class B air space so if this don't delay you I like to meet some wear. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 19:41:29 -0500 To: From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Corvair on a KR2 Message-ID: <006001c019f6$b1bee1e0$a5f780ce@300emachine> VAirHeads, If you'd like to see a Corvair engine (almost) hanging on a KR2, check out Steve Makish's work at http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/CorvAIRCRAFT/KR2.html . Although it looks big in the pictures, it's actually much smaller than a C-85 or 0-200 (I know, cause I measured Troy's). My apologies to those on the CorvAIRCRAFT list (http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/CorvAIRCRAFT/) as they've already seen this... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 08:54:14 -0500 To: From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> Corvair on a KR2 Message-ID: <002101c01b2e$9adaf3e0$a5f780ce@300emachine> Eddie6870@aol.com wrote: > Does > anyone have a KR with a corvair engine actually flying? I've heard of one out west somewhere that was installed many years ago, but it's a low powered (85hp?) engine with the blower fan still on it (which robs even more), and he's got about a million hours on it. Not very representative of what we're doing lately though. It won't be long though, as both Steve Makish and Mike Garbez having flying KRs that are being converted to Corvair, and there are a lot more on the way... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 13:48:40 -0700 (PDT) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Mike Mims Subject: Re: KR> Corvair on a KR2 Message-ID: <20000910204840.3298.qmail@web1401.mail.yahoo.com> --- Mark Langford wrote: > Eddie6870@aol.com wrote: > > > Does > > anyone have a KR with a corvair engine actually > flying? > The one in my area (I have never seen it) has a low powered vair installed right out of the car. It has about the same performance as a 2180 powered KR so 80 to 85 hp is a good guess. Last time I talked with the guy he had nothing but positive things to say about the smoothness and power. He said he wished his installation was a little lighter but we wish that eh? ===== ........| .......-^- ....-/_____\- ...(O\__o__/O) ...[#]oxxxo[#] -----Y2K Bug--- Yes I drive one! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 21:08:25 -0500 To: From: "Mark Langford" Subject: sealed lead acid batteries Message-ID: <009001c01a02$d7307db0$a5f780ce@300emachine> JuiceHeads, Somebody asked about batteries the other day. I was just reading my web page (I like to check and make sure my opinion hasn't changed recently), and ran across these comments that might help. If you guys get tired of my drivel, just let me know... ------------------------------------------ I recently spent the entire DAY researching batteries. What got me started on this was seeing the Black Panther batteries in the Wicks catalog. They list one that has 600 CCA (cold cranking amps) that I later discovered is a 16Ah (at 10 hours) battery, for $113. I looked at Gills, Bells, Interstates, etc, and finally came full circle to the actual manufacturer of the Black Panther, which is Hawker Energy Products. The standard aircraft batteries are typically 25 or 35 Ah. The AGM technology used in the Hawker Genesis batteries makes them very reliable and with an amazingly high CCA value for cranking things like large 6 cylinder Corvair engines. They are also permanently sealed (by definition) and can be mounted in any orientation. My KR2S electrical system is going to be very current miserly. My radio and transponder are Terra (less than 2A combined), strobes are Kuntzlemann (less than 2A draw), ignition is coil and points (1A per 1000 rpm, according to William) totaling 3A at cruise, and my nav lights are super bright LEDs (Stefan Belatchev's idea) that draw less than .1A. All of this can be turned off so that only the engine's coil and fuel pump are running, which totals 3.7 amps. My ignition switch will control ignition coil and fuel pump without a breaker inline (if either quits, you're going down anyway), but all other electrical items will be separate and will have breaker/switches. The G12V16EP battery that I chose will run this "minimum load" for 4 hours! And if my Corvair runs anything like the rest of my cars, it'll start in 1 or 2 seconds, mininizing starting drain. My EIS (Engine Information System) has programmable alarms, and the voltage trigger level can be set to something like 13 volts so that if my alternator quits charging, the EIS will immediately notify me and I'll have something like 2 hours to find a landing spot even without bothering to switch off the radio and transponder! For ME, that's a good enough margin. And it is very compact, with a height of only 3 inches, perfect for the upper firewall shelf of a KR. Best of all, it weighs 13.5 pounds, half the weight of a 35Ah Gill! The icing on the cake is that I ordered it for $64 from one of Hawker's suppliers, Battery Specialties, Inc (1-800-854-5759). That's half what Wicks charges. Battery Specialties is the third place I called, and they just happen to have a bunch of these on order, and they'll be getting them in 4 weeks. More typical is a 6 month waiting list! There must be a reason why these things are in such high demand. Yes, I'll do the testing to make sure that my electrical system has a sufficient margin of safety (after all, my wife's going to be flying this thing, along with my kids, someday), and if I need to, I can add another 13Ah battery (11 pounds) for a backup battery. These two batteries COMBINED weigh less than a Gill, and have almost the same reserve current capacity, but far more cranking power. If you're not inclined to live on the edge like me, you could always buy the G12V26EP for $98 and have one FINE 26Ah battery, with 800 CCA and the potential to mount in any orientation. I also discovered the Interstate U1-33AGM, a 33Ah battery that you should be able to get at your local Interstate dealer for about $85. It uses the same AGM technology and is also permanently sealed like the others I've mentioned. After talking to several other aircraft owners, I've found several others using similar batteries, one even using an 8Ah battery to power his 2.2 liter JPX engine, so I think I'm on the right track here... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 00:25:13 -0400 To: "krnet" From: "w.g. kirkland" Subject: Great Joy Message-ID: <007701c01a15$f392e660$d0905bd1@kirkland> ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C019F4.6B63EF80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This has nothing to do with KR's but it is Friday and at 1651 today I = became a grandfather. A 9 lb 5 oz grand daughter. Life is good. W.G.(Bill) KIRKLAND kirkland@vianet.on.ca ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C019F4.6B63EF80-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 22:07:51 -0700 To: kirkland@vianet.on.ca From: Lon V Boothby Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Great Joy Message-ID: <20000908.220926.-4016291.0.LBoothby@juno.com> Congratulations, Bill! Lon On Sat, 9 Sep 2000 00:25:13 -0400 "w.g. kirkland" writes: > This has nothing to do with KR's but it is Friday and at 1651 today I > became a grandfather. A 9 lb 5 oz grand daughter. Life is good. > W.G.(Bill) KIRKLAND > kirkland@vianet.on.ca ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 15:01:48 -0500 To: KR-Net From: Mark Jones Subject: Back at it!!! Message-ID: <39BA972C.7E34F3EA@execpc.com> Hello friends, I finally did it! After no construction progress since 4-25-00, I have managed to work on my vertical stabilizer today. The airfoil templates are now in place on the vertical stabilizer and will be proceeding to set the foam soon. The lull in construction was due to buying a house and doing a lot of remodeling, which is not finished. I guess when you have a house it really never is. The wife left this morning with my oldest son for a birthday party out of town which will take about six hours. When she left there was a list of "honey do's" from her. Well, I walked out in the garage took a look at the 2S, threw her list on the work table and started working on the plane!!! Sometimes a man has just got to do what a man has to do!!!!!!!! Just think, two weeks from today, we will all be doing what needs to be done in Kentucky. -- Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at mailto:flykr2s@execpc.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://sites.netscape.net/flykr2s/homepage ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 18:53:07 -0500 To: "Leonardo" , "Florin L Pintea" , "KR-Net" , "larry flesner" From: "JEAN VERON" Subject: Re: KR> Prop size Message-ID: <000f01c01ab9$5d45c7a0$ded8193f@computer> I finally got to check out the Sterba prop Marty is running. It is a 56" dia. X 74 pitch. he is indicating 187 mph at 2925 rpm. and 170 mph at 2600 rpm. He has just tried a Waneke but could not get any rpm's so he sent it back for them to fix. Jean N4DD ----- Original Message ----- From: larry flesner To: Leonardo ; Florin L Pintea ; KR-Net Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 7:40 PM Subject: Re: KR> Prop size > > At 04:50 PM 5/23/00 -0300, Leonardo wrote: > >for the continental(o-200 100hp) engine . the prop i,m going to use is a > >wood prop made here in Brazil for a very competent guy called Rupert and is > >a 60"diameter x 66 picht for first trys .i hope this info is good for you. > > > Leo,Brazil,kr2s. > ======================================================================== > > I purchased a prop from Ed Sterba several years ago (not yet flown) > and he recommended a 60D X 68P for my 0-200. This is very close to > what Marty Roberts is running on his 0-200 although he has had > several different prop and I don't know what he is flying right > now. Maybe Gene could give us more info for the 0-200 as he flys > with Marty and is converting "Ole Blue" to the 0-200. > > Larry Flesner > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 19:04:38 +0100 To: "JEAN VERON" From: "macwood" Cc: "krnet user group" Subject: Fw: KR> Prop size Message-ID: <002a01c01b56$cbcb2740$1b0a3c3e@tinypc> ----- Original Message ----- From: macwood To: JEAN VERON Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 12:34 PM Subject: Re: KR> Prop size > Hi Jean, I had the privilege of getting my first KR ride with Marty > back in 91?( Kentucky).Can it be the same KR he's flying now. What > engine is he using with that enormous pitch?! Didn't he win a closed cicuit > race at a 194mph,back in the early 90's or did I dream it? The pundits over > here can't believe you can get those figures out of a KR! Regards to > all, especially to Marty if anyone is in touch. > Cheers! Mac England UK > ----- Original Message ----- > From: JEAN VERON > To: Leonardo ; Florin L Pintea ; > KR-Net ; larry flesner > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 12:53 AM > Subject: Re: KR> Prop size > > > > I finally got to check out the Sterba prop Marty is running. It is a 56" > > dia. X 74 pitch. he is indicating 187 mph at 2925 rpm. and 170 mph at 2600 > > rpm. He has just tried a Waneke but could not get any rpm's so he sent it > > back for them to fix. > > Jean > > N4DD > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: larry flesner > > To: Leonardo ; Florin L Pintea ; > > KR-Net > > Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 7:40 PM > > Subject: Re: KR> Prop size > > > > > > > > > > At 04:50 PM 5/23/00 -0300, Leonardo wrote: > > > >for the continental(o-200 100hp) engine . the prop i,m going to use is > a > > > >wood prop made here in Brazil for a very competent guy called Rupert > and > > is > > > >a 60"diameter x 66 picht for first trys .i hope this info is good for > > you. > > > > > > > Leo,Brazil,kr2s. > > > ======================================================================== > > > > > > I purchased a prop from Ed Sterba several years ago (not yet flown) > > > and he recommended a 60D X 68P for my 0-200. This is very close to > > > what Marty Roberts is running on his 0-200 although he has had > > > several different prop and I don't know what he is flying right > > > now. Maybe Gene could give us more info for the 0-200 as he flys > > > with Marty and is converting "Ole Blue" to the 0-200. > > > > > > Larry Flesner > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 00:18:11 -0300 To: "KR-net" From: "Eduardo Iglesias" Subject: Was not MSI Message-ID: <000201c01b4c$f49a6f00$a21c33c8@EduardoIglesias> ------=_NextPart_000_0390_01C01ABC.9AE5D020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My EIS (Engine Information System) has programmable alarms,=20 Will you forgive me?, it was not MSI, but EIS; it happens that I have = less time if I want to finish building.=20 Eduardo emiglesias@cpenet.com.ar=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0390_01C01ABC.9AE5D020-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 23:13:10 +0200 To: "Krnet@Mailinglists. Org" From: "Peter Nauta" Subject: RE: KR> cowling mold Message-ID: Mark, I might start building in this next year; I plan to build a trigear "S"with the new foils. If there are plans to make wing skins for the new AS foils, and I can convince the local authorities that's a good idea, I'll be in the market for them, as I am sort of held back by the idea of constructing a laminar flow wing while having zero experience with composites. So, if you're doing market research here, see this as a possible sale. Questions: 1. I have no idea the way a wing is actually constructed using wing skins. How is a positive adhesion between spar and sking reached, as the spar has to be sanded down to the exact profile, and glueing ths to the skin can't be checked for bonding area, or are the skins transparent enough to be able to check this? 2. Are 18% foils being considered, because I would like to accomodate for fuel tanks in the wing roots rather than a tank aft of the firewall "in your lap". Regards, Peter Nauta > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Langford [mailto:langford@hiwaay.net] > Sent: Friday, September 08, 2000 3:45 AM > To: krnet@mailinglists.org > Subject: KR> cowling mold > > > CowlHeads, > > I played hookie from work Tuesday afternoon and visited Troy in Columbia. > He and Jeff Duval were planning to pull a mold off of Troy's cowling and > make themselves two lighter ones. Jeff has a similar engine > intallation to > Troy's C-85, and since Troy's already got the bulges and blisters in the > right places, it was a no-brainer. After all of the reworking over the > years for several different engine configurations (not to mention crash > damage), Troy's cowling had blossomed to 17 pounds! Hence, the > carbon fiber > scheme was born. > > What is truly amazing is the lack of effort they really put into > this. They > were both in a big hurry because of Troy's limited time off from flight > duties, and the close proximity of the Gathering. They lightly sanded > Troy's cowling, waxed it several times, shot on a quick coat of PVA, and > laid up a layer of mat glass, 2 or 3 layers of KR glass cloth (with > polyester resin), and let it cure. A few hours later the molds popped > right off the parts. More wax and mold release and the carbon fiber (3 > layers for the top half, two for the bottom) wetted out with > epoxy were laid > up on the mold, and the next day, a cowling was born! The new cowlings > weigh 3 pounds each and look fantastic! And they really made it > look easy. > > It's probably safe to say that not only might there soon be a source for > lightweight C-85/0-200 cowlings, but quite possibly AS5046 wing skins and > other parts too. I may very well clone my Corvair cowling when I > finish it. > There's no sense in us all reinventing the wheel everytime we build one of > these things. I've already got dibs on Troy's old cowling, so don't ask. > Stay tuned... > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama > mailto:langford@hiwaay.net > see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 19:21:51 -0500 To: "Krnet@Mailinglists. Org" From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> cowling mold/wing skins Message-ID: <001f01c01b86$48d685c0$a5f780ce@300emachine> Peter Nauta wrote: > 1. I have no idea the way a wing is actually constructed using wing skins. Peter, I would think that shipping a set of wing skins to the Netherlands would be prohibitively expensive. I really didn't think the way I made mine was all that difficult or time consuming. It's pretty well detailed at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/owings.html . (If some of the pictures don't display, right click on them and click on "show picture" or whatever it takes. I guess I need to split that page into 2 or 3 pages for ease of loading. I've got the whole page loaded and Task Manager says I'm using 185 Meg of RAM.) Personally, I think you can make a truer airfoil surface using my method than you can using two piece wing skins. Judging by today's Smooth Prime application, I'd have to say they've turned out just great! Pictures tomorrow, maybe. I wouldn't argue that wing skins would be a lot easier to install, but I don't see me personally making any. That's for liability reasons and the fact that I'd be losing money, since they keep begging me to work overtime at TBE (and I just smile and head for the basement). I may make a plug and TET might farm out the work, however. That's been bantered about somewhat. And if we make wing skins, the AS5048/45 would be the first on the list. If you start with the tail surfaces, and then do the front deck, canopy frame, and aft deck, there won't be any magic to composites by the time you get to the wings. At least that's the way I did it., and now they've got me teaching composites at the forum every year! Wing skins are just stuck over the stock spars and floxed in place. As far as gluing wing skins to the spar, I'd think what you'd do is pile up a mound of epoxy/flox for the skin to "bed" into. There'll be a mess as the stuff is squished all over the place inside the wing, but nobody will every see it, and contact with the spar is all but guaranteed. Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************