From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 14 Nov 2000 14:04:57 -0000 Issue 124 Date: Tuesday, November 14, 2000 6:05 AM krnet Digest 14 Nov 2000 14:04:57 -0000 Issue 124 Topics (messages 2928 through 2957): Re: Teflon Tape 2928 by: Cary Honeywell 2930 by: cartera 2932 by: Ralph H Snyder 2945 by: GARYKR2.cs.com 2946 by: virgnvs.juno.com 2947 by: virgnvs.juno.com 2950 by: Frank Ross 2956 by: KR2616TJ.aol.com 2957 by: virgnvs.juno.com Rolling and Tipping 2929 by: Peter Johnson 2931 by: Ned Thomas Re: rudder pedal return spring 2933 by: KR2616TJ.aol.com 2940 by: B&B Muse wing/fiberglassing and return springs 2934 by: Oscar Zuniga smaller AN hardware 2935 by: Oscar Zuniga Re: control options 2936 by: B&B Muse Re: CG 2937 by: Jim Faughn 2944 by: GARYKR2.cs.com Re: Polyurethane Paint 2938 by: jshays CONTROL WHEEL 2939 by: Phil Visconti Re: CONTROL WHEEL/Newsletters 2941 by: Frank Ross 2948 by: Phil Visconti 2949 by: CHOCTAWCWR.aol.com 2951 by: Frank Ross Re: Finish Paint techniques 2942 by: Tracy & Carol O'Brien 2943 by: Ron Eason Further to Rolling and Tipping... 2952 by: Peter Johnson 2954 by: The Stones urgeon) 2953 by: Michael Taglieri Newsletters 2955 by: KR2616TJ.aol.com Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 23:26:26 -0500 To: From: "Cary Honeywell" Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <001301c04d29$e319ca50$0205a8c0@server1> Standard practice is to not use Teflon tape on any aircraft component regardless of where it is. The tape has a tendency to flake and strip, ultimately ending up where it is not supposed to be. Engines might be ok, but best not get into the habit of using it. I have a DG that someone used Teflon tape in. The suction pulled it into the machinery and toasted the unit. Your call though. - Cary - -Cary Honeywell - Ottawa Ontario Canada caryh@home.com ve3ev@rac.ca Home page http://24.112.208.98/ KR2 area http://24.112.208.98/kr2/kr2.shtml Ottawa ATC http://cr726239-a.slnt1.on.wave.home.com/demo3.ram ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Peyton" To: Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 11:02 PM Subject: KR> Teflon Tape > In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending switch, which > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon tape. That seems mighty > strange to me. Does anyone know why we should'nt use teflon tape for this > application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with teflon tape any > way. > > _________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 21:48:08 -0700 To: Doug Peyton From: cartera CC: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <3A0F7288.3DBEB5CF@cuug.ab.ca> Hello Gang, Nothing strange about this, this is not waterworks and the practices are a bit different. How would you like a piece of this tape get into your lubricating system, I know your going to tell me you not going to put it near the tip. My suggestion is follow instructions, these guys have probably forgot more than we will ever know. Good aeronautical advise and practice. I never used teflon anywhere and did not have a leak. Doug Peyton wrote: > > In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending switch, which > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon tape. That seems mighty > strange to me. Does anyone know why we should'nt use teflon tape for this > application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with teflon tape any > way. > > _________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org -- Adrian VE6AFY Calgary, Alberta Mailto:cartera@cuug.ab.ca http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~cartera ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:49:50 -0800 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Ralph H Snyder Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <20001112.224950.-4009381.0.ralphndori@juno.com> Teflon tape is an insulator. you need to have a good contact through the threads for the oil pressure sender to work. On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 04:02:21 CET "Doug Peyton" writes: > In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending switch, > which > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon tape. That seems > mighty > strange to me. Does anyone know why we should'nt use teflon tape > for this > application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with teflon tape > any > way. > > _________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at > http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:09:05 EST To: doug_peyton@hotmail.com, krnet@mailinglists.org From: GARYKR2@cs.com Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <7c.d63bbbb.2741f8c1@cs.com> In a message dated 11/12/00 10:03:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, doug_peyton@hotmail.com writes: << In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending switch, which has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use Teflon tape. That seems mighty strange to me. Does anyone know why we shouldn't use Teflon tape for this application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with Teflon tape any way. >> Teflon tape can be used if you are careful in how you apply it to the threads. Start the tape leaving the first 2 threads bare. Use only 2 to 3 wraps. The key to using the tape is not allowing it to get past any of the threads and getting into the case. The same method should be used when working with the silicon sealers. Gary Hinkle (A/P) Middletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:48:59 -0500 To: doug_peyton@hotmail.com From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <20001113.223106.-360569.1.virgnvs@juno.com> O.K.Guys, let the verbosity begin! Pipe threads have an inherent taper to allow sealing without any other sealing compounds necessary. Also, when teflon tape is used on some things, the item into which it screws into may split ie aluminum fittings. Forsake the tape and use the toothpaste like teflon to seal the joint.Virg On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 04:02:21 CET "Doug Peyton" writes: > In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending switch, > which > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon tape. That seems > mighty > strange to me. Does anyone know why we should'nt use teflon tape > for this > application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with teflon tape > any > way. > > _________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at > http://www.hotmail.com. > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagh. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:01:18 -0500 To: caryh@home.com From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <20001113.223106.-360569.2.virgnvs@juno.com> Teflon tape properly appliede willNOT cause any problems! It must be applied from the top of the male fitting to the thread just before the last thread and in a direction that is the same as turning the male fitting into the female fitting, i.e.OPPOSITE of the thread rotation. From the rear of the male fitting that would be Counterclockwise. This keeps the teflon away from the end of the fitting not allowing any tape to enter the inside of the tube,etc. Being wound the proper direction keeps it from unwinding and coming loose. Virg outta breth On Sun, 12 Nov 2000 23:26:26 -0500 "Cary Honeywell" writes: > Standard practice is to not use Teflon tape on any aircraft component > regardless of where it is. The tape has a tendency to flake and > strip, > ultimately ending up where it is not supposed to be. Engines might > be ok, > but best not get into the habit of using it. > > I have a DG that someone used Teflon tape in. The suction pulled it > into the > machinery and toasted the unit. > > Your call though. > > - Cary - > > -Cary Honeywell - > Ottawa Ontario Canada > caryh@home.com > ve3ev@rac.ca > Home page http://24.112.208.98/ > KR2 area http://24.112.208.98/kr2/kr2.shtml > Ottawa ATC http://cr726239-a.slnt1.on.wave.home.com/demo3.ram > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Doug Peyton" > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 11:02 PM > Subject: KR> Teflon Tape > > > > In the instructions for installing the oil pressure sending > switch, which > > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon tape. That seems > mighty > > strange to me. Does anyone know why we should'nt use teflon tape > for this > > application? I've a strong inclination to go ahead with teflon > tape any > > way. > > > > > _________________________________________________________________________ > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at > http://www.hotmail.com. > > > > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile > at > > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:27:10 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Frank Ross Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <20001114042710.15400.qmail@web4705.mail.yahoo.com> Virg, Hope yu were on oxygen when you wrote this... --- virgnvs@juno.com wrote: > Teflon tape properly appliede willNOT cause any > problems! > It must be applied from the top of the male fitting > to the thread > just before the last thread and in a direction that > is the same as > turning the male fitting into the female fitting, > i.e.OPPOSITE of the > thread rotation. From the rear of the male fitting > that would be > Counterclockwise. This keeps the teflon away from > the end of > the fitting not allowing any tape to enter the > inside of the tube,etc. > Being wound the proper direction keeps it from > unwinding and > coming loose. Virg outta breth > > On Sun, 12 Nov 2000 23:26:26 -0500 "Cary Honeywell" > > writes: > > Standard practice is to not use Teflon tape on any > aircraft component > > regardless of where it is. The tape has a tendency > to flake and > > strip, > > ultimately ending up where it is not supposed to > be. Engines might > > be ok, > > but best not get into the habit of using it. > > > > I have a DG that someone used Teflon tape in. The > suction pulled it > > into the > > machinery and toasted the unit. > > > > Your call though. > > > > - Cary - > > > > -Cary Honeywell - > > Ottawa Ontario Canada > > caryh@home.com > > ve3ev@rac.ca > > Home page http://24.112.208.98/ > > KR2 area http://24.112.208.98/kr2/kr2.shtml > > Ottawa ATC > http://cr726239-a.slnt1.on.wave.home.com/demo3.ram > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Doug Peyton" > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 11:02 PM > > Subject: KR> Teflon Tape > > > > > > > In the instructions for installing the oil > pressure sending > > switch, which > > > has 1/8" NPT, it says one MAY NOT use teflon > tape. That seems > > mighty > > > strange to me. Does anyone know why we > should'nt use teflon tape > > for this > > > application? I've a strong inclination to go > ahead with teflon > > tape any > > > way. > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________________ > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail > at > > http://www.hotmail.com. > > > > > > Share information about yourself, create your > own public profile > > at > > > http://profiles.msn.com. > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To post to the list, email: > krnet@mailinglists.org > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE > software, visit: > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ===== Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Get organized for the holidays! http://calendar.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:41:38 EST To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: Who posted the thread about you not using teflon tape because it's insulating properties. Could you expound on this? Dana Overall 2000 KR Gathering host Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 08:55:04 -0500 To: KR2616TJ@aol.com From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Teflon Tape Message-ID: <20001114.090422.-171949.1.virgnvs@juno.com> Could be that the pressure sender uses the threads to complete the ground circuit. If not tightened properly you would not complete that circuit, no pressure reading, Virg Huff Puff On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:41:38 EST KR2616TJ@aol.com writes: > Who posted the thread about you not using teflon tape because it's > insulating > properties. Could you expound on this? > > > > Dana Overall > 2000 KR Gathering host > Richmond, KY > mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/hangar/7085/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 22:30:35 -0800 To: From: "Peter Johnson" Subject: Rolling and Tipping Message-ID: <00f801c04d3b$62aeb580$6ea5e2d1@peter> ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C04CF8.2D319B40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Now here's something I can help the list with. I have been using this = technique in the marine industry for going on 30 years. I just finished = a 36 IOR cold- molded, varnished, 'show boat' and used the rolling and = tipping technique for the same reason as in the past, rolling and = tipping will produce a better finish than spraying. Now that comment is = going to raise some comments I'm sure! Truth is, I don't think anyone = can say that they have ever seen a sprayed finished right off the gun = that does not have some orange peel. Rolling and tipping, with some = practise, will produce a finish that is as smooth as glass without = buffing. To anyone who is considering how they are going to finish and = paint their plane, consider this technique. It is simple, easy to = learn, and requires only a bit of practise and lots of looking! One comment that has followed along with regards to rolling and tipping = is the underlying need for good base prep. This cannot be stressed = enough. The first part of this description is based on my experiences = preparing surfaces. The secret to getting a good finish on a surface is not so much to have = a 'smooth' surface, but to have a 'flat' surface. To obtain a 'flat' = surface I would not recommend using an electric sander for the following = reasons: An electric sander will only cover an area about 4 1/4 x 7, it = is hard to move fast without it 'tripping' on itself, and it is too easy = to hold it in one place and sand away shadows. =20 The secret to producing a 'flat' finish on a large surface such as a = wing or fuse is to use a large sander!, it is called a sanding board. = Sanding boards are made to fit one full, or two full sheets of = sandpaper. I use cheap, 3-ply spruce plywood cut to size. On the back = side I attach two 1 1/2" dowells on blocks to use as handles, they = should be larger than smaller. On the front surface I completly smear = cheap paper paste such as 'YooHoo Glue Sticks' from the stationary = store, to attach a layer of dense, firm, but flexible foam such as cheap = mouse pads or that blue foam you can buy for sleeping on when you're = camping. On top of that, and still smearing lots of glue stick, I lay = on a layer of heavy vapour barrier plastic. The sandpaper is attached = to the plastic using the glue stick applied just inside the edges of the = sandpaper sheet. To explain the above, the cheap 3 ply plywood is used = because it has 'some' flexibilty, the foam is used to allow some = conformance to curved surfaces, (if your surface is very rough to begin = with, build another sanding board without the foam and use it sparingly, = just enough to knock down the high spots), and the plastic allows easy = removal of the sandpaper, the smooth, round handles allow you to easily = roll your hands on the handles, and the glue sticks are used because you = can use water to soak off old sandpaper and glue residue buildups. Now to use your new sanding boards, take a soft lead pencil and softly = scribble all over your work surface. Position the work so that you can = comfortably use the board, (you'll figure this out quickly), and start = sanding, I wouldn't use anything much rougher than 120G to begin. Use = your entire body to move the sanding board over a large, long, area of = the work, and sand in long, sweeping strokes. Don't hesitate to move = your work surface to accomodate your 'swing' and allow you to be = comfortable. When sanding the fuse, sand fore and aft, when sanding the = wings, sand inboard/outboard. The removal of the pencil marks will = indicate when you've sanded an area enough. Be prepared to discover = that it takes very little time to sand an area like a KR wing, and you = will probably find that you are moving in an almost constant = 'swing-step, swing-step' procedure. =20 So does this sound like a lot of work? Yes it does. Is it a lot of = work? No it isn't. As an example, I spent twelve hours ROUGH sanding = the last coat of epoxy on the above boat using 40G paper, it took 6 = hours using a double sheet sanding board and 120G paper to cover the = same area! (PS, use 'C', or 'D' weight sandpaper, (the heavy stuff), = and use aluminim oxide, it lasts) A couple of details....Any area that must be sanded my hand (small, = detail sanding), should be done first. Don't hesitate to hang a = flexible vacuum cleaner hose off the sanding board, wear hearing = protection, don't plan on this taking a long time!, it doesn't!, drink = plenty of water (this is applicable to anything in life), wear a dust = mask!!!!, and DON'T try using a sanding board to wet sand. It is = hilarious to discover why; every once in a while the wet sandpaper will = 'vacuum seal' itself to the surface and you'll be 15 feet sideways and = still flying before you realise what happened! On small surfaces such = as a KR wing it will take very little energy completly sand the surface. = Start sanding with 120G and go as fine as you like always vacuuming and = using soft pencil scribblings between sandings. Tomorrow I'll explain my experiences using primers etc. mailto:pjohnson@voyageur.ca ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01C04CF8.2D319B40-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 23:58:45 -0600 To: Peter Johnson From: Ned Thomas CC: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Rolling and Tipping Message-ID: <3A0F8314.4E7EB0B5@mmcable.com> Peter, It is great to hear someone talk about rolling and tipping who actually u= ses this method. Thanks for sharing with us! Please keep it coming. Esp= ecially include the nitty gritty details. Like, what thickness is the 3 = ply plywood that you use to make the sanding boards? Where do you find t= he sandpaper big enough to fit the boards? What is the best fillers that= don't shrink? Thanks a bunch, Ned Peter Johnson wrote: > Now here's something I can help the list with. I have been using this = technique in the marine industry for going on 30 years. I just finished = a 36 IOR cold- molded, varnished, 'show boat' and used the rolling and ti= pping technique for the same reason as in the past, rolling and tipping w= ill produce a better finish than spraying. Now that comment is going to = raise some comments I'm sure! Truth is, I don't think anyone can say tha= t they have ever seen a sprayed finished right off the gun that does not = have some orange peel. Rolling and tipping, with some practise, will pro= duce a finish that is as smooth as glass without buffing. To anyone who = is considering how they are going to finish and paint their plane, consid= er this technique. It is simple, easy to learn, and requires only a bit = of practise and lots of looking! > > One comment that has followed along with regards to rolling and tipping= is the underlying need for good base prep. This cannot be stressed enou= gh. The first part of this description is based on my experiences prepar= ing surfaces. > > The secret to getting a good finish on a surface is not so much to have= a 'smooth' surface, but to have a 'flat' surface. To obtain a 'flat' su= rface I would not recommend using an electric sander for the following re= asons: An electric sander will only cover an area about 4 1/4 x 7, it is= hard to move fast without it 'tripping' on itself, and it is too easy to= hold it in one place and sand away shadows. > > The secret to producing a 'flat' finish on a large surface such as a wi= ng or fuse is to use a large sander!, it is called a sanding board. Sand= ing boards are made to fit one full, or two full sheets of sandpaper. I = use cheap, 3-ply spruce plywood cut to size. On the back side I attach t= wo 1 1/2" dowells on blocks to use as handles, they should be larger tha= n smaller. On the front surface I completly smear cheap paper paste such= as 'YooHoo Glue Sticks' from the stationary store, to attach a layer of = dense, firm, but flexible foam such as cheap mouse pads or that blue foam= you can buy for sleeping on when you're camping. On top of that, and st= ill smearing lots of glue stick, I lay on a layer of heavy vapour barrier= plastic. The sandpaper is attached to the plastic using the glue stick = applied just inside the edges of the sandpaper sheet. To explain the abo= ve, the cheap 3 ply plywood is used because it has 'some' flexibilty, the= foam is used to allow some conformance to curved > surfaces, (if your surface is very rough to begin with, build another s= anding board without the foam and use it sparingly, just enough to knock = down the high spots), and the plastic allows easy removal of the sandpape= r, the smooth, round handles allow you to easily roll your hands on the h= andles, and the glue sticks are used because you can use water to soak of= f old sandpaper and glue residue buildups. > > Now to use your new sanding boards, take a soft lead pencil and softly = scribble all over your work surface. Position the work so that you can c= omfortably use the board, (you'll figure this out quickly), and start san= ding, I wouldn't use anything much rougher than 120G to begin. Use your = entire body to move the sanding board over a large, long, area of the wor= k, and sand in long, sweeping strokes. Don't hesitate to move your work = surface to accomodate your 'swing' and allow you to be comfortable. When= sanding the fuse, sand fore and aft, when sanding the wings, sand inboar= d/outboard. The removal of the pencil marks will indicate when you've sa= nded an area enough. Be prepared to discover that it takes very little t= ime to sand an area like a KR wing, and you will probably find that you a= re moving in an almost constant 'swing-step, swing-step' procedure. > > So does this sound like a lot of work? Yes it does. Is it a lot of wo= rk? No it isn't. As an example, I spent twelve hours ROUGH sanding the = last coat of epoxy on the above boat using 40G paper, it took 6 hours usi= ng a double sheet sanding board and 120G paper to cover the same area! (= PS, use 'C', or 'D' weight sandpaper, (the heavy stuff), and use aluminim= oxide, it lasts) > > A couple of details....Any area that must be sanded my hand (small, det= ail sanding), should be done first. Don't hesitate to hang a flexible va= cuum cleaner hose off the sanding board, wear hearing protection, don't p= lan on this taking a long time!, it doesn't!, drink plenty of water (this= is applicable to anything in life), wear a dust mask!!!!, and DON'T try = using a sanding board to wet sand. It is hilarious to discover why; ever= y once in a while the wet sandpaper will 'vacuum seal' itself to the surf= ace and you'll be 15 feet sideways and still flying before you realise wh= at happened! On small surfaces such as a KR wing it will take very littl= e energy completly sand the surface. Start sanding with 120G and go as f= ine as you like always vacuuming and using soft pencil scribblings betwee= n sandings. > > Tomorrow I'll explain my experiences using primers etc. > > mailto:pjohnson@voyageur.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:14:34 EST To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> rudder pedal return spring Message-ID: <99.c782a01.2741433a@aol.com> At 01:11 PM 11/12/00 -0500, virgnvs@juno.com wrote: > Our intellegence level should make any of my replies >obvious. Think outside the box, Sorry guys, but my comments here are not meant to spur an arguement but one word blurbs, spoken as the gospel, just don't get it with me. Well, I'll do just that. The spring is attached to the firewall, then attached to the rudder pedal. If the spring breaks, you just KEEP your foot on the rudder pedal. Hel@#$!@#$, your foot is going to be there anyway. If one of the additional pulleys you have to put in for a complete system fails, you've got a tremendous amount of slack and you're up the proverbial creek (see explanation on this point in next paragraph). I hate to argue in front of everyone, but I must not be intelligent (and I spelled it right:-) enough to see the additional safety by adding more moving parts. Both systems will work fine. I just like the spring system better. It's my decision. On another point...... There is absolutely no way (boy, one of those never statements again:-), you are going to continually apply enough pressure with a small spring to stress the cables. Thinking outside the box here............cable.....or wood firewall, cable......or wood firewall. My bet is the firewall will give way if I were using an automobile suspension spring. We're talking small spring here. During my commercial training and studies, I learned that if one side of a rudder system fails, you simply apply opposite rudder (you can't do this if one of the additional pulleys fails) so as to load up that side of the rudder. This is done to avoid any flutter with a runaway system, offset this with aileron, and land the airplane. Pucker factor, sure but non doable, absolutely not. Boy, we've started a firestorm here haven't we..............just like the election:-) this does not prove the what's bad about our form of discussion, it proves what is good and great about our discussion:-). Now, back into the foxhole and reload my supply of hand gernades.......move over Ron Freiberger, I'm diving in......is Melody Mountains in there also.......WOO HOO. Dana Overall 2000 KR Gathering host Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:13:33 -0600 To: Krwr1@aol.com From: B&B Muse CC: virgnvs@juno.com, flesner@midwest.net, KR2616TJ@aol.com, krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> rudder pedal return spring Message-ID: <3A103D5C.7F2F653C@ev1.net> --------------06DD03548B8D317D23B3EF86 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Krwr1@aol.com wrote: > > > > What are your feet doing on a spring failure? the only thing the springs > does is keep the slack out of the cable when your feet is off the rudder > peddles. I think there's a lot of worrying about nothing. > Bill > I agree with Bill. My rudder cable system is a closed system with a single tension spring in the middle of the cable at the firewall that connects the two rudder pedals together. The closed system allows the rudder pedals to allow work opposite each other. The spring keeps the all of the rudder system cables in slight tension at all times while allowing for some stretching of the cables during extreme weather changes. Also, I can take my feet off of the rudder pedals in flight and the the pedals stay put(don't flop down). If the spring were to break, so what, I would have to keep my feet on the pedals but the feel of the rudder would be the same. Not true if you a return spring for each side. Bobby Muse --------------06DD03548B8D317D23B3EF86-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:10:12 GMT To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: wing/fiberglassing and return springs Message-ID: Carter wrote: >Is it possible/safe to fiberglass in doors i.e. my basement? >Or will the smell/fumes be too much? Depends on what type of resin you're using. I'm using AeroPoxy, and have worked it in my garage for going on 3 years now... never a single mention or complaint from my family, and they are very, very sensitive to smells such as spray paint, thinners, etc. If you're using vinylester resin... whole 'nother ballgame! I will be using vinylester for building the fuel tanks and anything I think might be exposed to fuel, since it's supposed to be fuel-proof. I don't know about the polyester resins for smell, but in my opinion you should be using an epoxy resin anyway ;o) Might as well throw in my 2 cents on the return spring issue while I'm at it: I'm using the rudder return springs advertised as those used on the EZs; Tony Bingelis also shows the return spring setup as being simple and light. With those two endorsements, it's good enough for me. Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.geocities.com/taildrags/ _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:14:31 GMT To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: smaller AN hardware Message-ID: Bob Smith wrote: >Is it possible to get AN hardware with smaller diameters than this? (AN3) Depending on the application, you can use the AN525/525R, which are available on down in #8 and maybe #6. They are also very good where you have a tight clearance situation and the bolt head on an AN3 with a washer is too thick for your available space. Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.geocities.com/taildrags/ _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:38:07 -0600 To: Mark Jones From: B&B Muse CC: Drew Swenson , krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> control options Message-ID: <3A0FFCCF.2505EFDE@ev1.net> --------------2BB9D12F465CE3DF073D1A8F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark Jones wrote: > > Drew, > Keep it simple and use the stick. Besides, I have never heard of a KR with a wheel. Seem like it would be a complex set up with unnecessary weight added. > MJ > > Drew Swenson wrote: > > > I am nearing the stage of choosing what controls to use; I just cannot seem to decide between stick or wheel. They both have disadvantages and advantages, but I would like to here from KR flyers to see what their view torard this decision. > > > > Thank you, > > Drewlive@prodigy.net > > > > > > -- > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > There have been a few KRs with a control wheel. Most notable was Herb Bull's KR which had a swing-over wheel similar to the Beechcraft design. If the passenger wanted to take control, Herb could just unlock the pilot's position and swing the wheel over to the passenger. I believe the design was done by Bill DeFreeze many years ago and I think was in some of the old KR Newsletters. But a control stick is the most simple design and simple to build. Bobby Muse --------------2BB9D12F465CE3DF073D1A8F-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:49:36 -0600 To: "KR Net Response" From: "Jim Faughn" Subject: Re: KR> CG Message-ID: Congratulations!!!! It sounds like your plane came out within about 8 pounds of my plane. I have flown it at 1,100 pounds and it flew fine. However, the cg while still 2 1/2 inches in front of the aft limit still made it very interesting on take off and landing. I wouldn't call it unsafe, rather, it was just different than what I was used to. I do believe that if the cg was back an inch or two more it would be real interesting. Again, congratulations and take your time expanding your flight envelope. You Wrote: - - - - - Good news---------N6399U passed with flying colors, under all load conditions sitting on 3 calibrated scales,I stayed well within the specified range. Even with my Engineer friend at 170Lbs in the right seat and me at 240lbs I was still 2" fwd of my aft CG. The bare aircraft came in at 636 lbs, and with myself ,Dwight, and full fuel, gross was 1121 lbs. I don't know if flying at that weight would be practical though, since the plans only call for something less than 1000lbs. Any thoughts?????--------------Kenny Jim Faughn 4323D Laclede Ave. St. Louis, MO 63108 (314) 652-7659 mailto:jfaughn@mvp.net N891JF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:59:17 EST To: klw1953@juno.com, RFG842@aol.com From: GARYKR2@cs.com CC: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> CG Message-ID: <65.bc8267f.2741f675@cs.com> In a message dated 11/12/00 7:36:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, klw1953@juno.com writes: << Good news---------N6399U passed with flying colors, under all load conditions sitting on 3 calibrated scales,I stayed well within the specified range. Even with my Engineer friend at 170Lbs in the right seat and me at 240lbs I was still 2" fwd of my aft CG. The bare aircraft came in at 636 lbs, and with myself ,Dwight, and full fuel, gross was 1121 lbs. I don't know if flying at that weight would be practical though, since the plans only call for something less than 1000lbs. Any thoughts?????--------------Kenny >> I have my "2" at 1150 gross. It has flown at 1130 lb. with no problem. The only thing you will notice is how pitch sensitive it will be. Not unsafe, just touchy. Gary Hinkle (A/P) Middletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 00 10:20:28 -0600 To: "Doug Peyton" , krnet From: jshays Subject: RE: KR> Polyurethane Paint I like to paint in the 60 degree range, with low humidity. Actually I have painted below 60 with good results, but it stays tacky for a long time. The worst thing is high humidity. Make sure to wear a fresh air mask as well. Jeff. >===== Original Message From "Doug Peyton" ===== >What are/is the necessary weather conditions for spraying two-part >polyurethane paint? Does this stuff require controlled conditions? > >_________________________________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > >Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at >http://profiles.msn.com. > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org >To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:24:19 -0500 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Phil Visconti Subject: CONTROL WHEEL Message-ID: <3A1015B3.1BB379DF@gis.net> --------------71B6323EEA01928C6B1EEFBE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bill DeFreze had sketched throw-over control to illustrate what he had done. The explanation and drawings are on pages 3 & 4 of KR Newsletter #52 dtd Oct. 1979. I'm afraid if I scan the Newsletter, and put it on the net, I may infringe on someone's rights. Does anyone know if these old Newsletters are Copyrighted ? Phil Visconti Marlboro, MA --------------71B6323EEA01928C6B1EEFBE-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:44:05 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Frank Ross Subject: Re: KR> CONTROL WHEEL/Newsletters Message-ID: <20001113214405.3365.qmail@web4701.mail.yahoo.com> --- Phil Visconti wrote: > Bill DeFreze had sketched throw-over control to > illustrate what he had done. > The explanation and drawings are on pages 3 & 4 of > KR Newsletter #52 dtd Oct. 1979.Does anyone know if > these old Newsletters are Copyrighted ? > > Phil Visconti > Marlboro, MA Phil, Others, All the older newsletters are at: http://www.geocities.com/krnewsletters/ So it shouldn't be hard to find. These are very informative and I'd like to thank Mark Lougheed for what must have been a HUGE project. It provides hours of great reading and KR history for me. ===== Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Get organized for the holidays! http://calendar.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 23:03:43 -0500 To: Frank Ross From: Phil Visconti CC: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> CONTROL WHEEL/Newsletters Message-ID: <3A10B99F.2C4780BD@gis.net> I have all the old Newsletters (except about 3). I was wondering if they had been copyrighted. Phil Visconti Frank Ross wrote: > --- Phil Visconti wrote: > > Bill DeFreze had sketched throw-over control to > > illustrate what he had done. > > The explanation and drawings are on pages 3 & 4 of > > KR Newsletter #52 dtd Oct. 1979.Does anyone know if > > these old Newsletters are Copyrighted ? > > > > Phil Visconti > > Marlboro, MA > > Phil, Others, > All the older newsletters are at: > http://www.geocities.com/krnewsletters/ > So it shouldn't be hard to find. These are very > informative and I'd like to thank Mark Lougheed for > what must have been a HUGE project. It provides hours > of great reading and KR history for me. > > ===== > Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Calendar - Get organized for the holidays! > http://calendar.yahoo.com/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 23:14:59 EST To: vicsani@gis.net, krnet@mailinglists.org From: CHOCTAWCWR@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> CONTROL WHEEL/Newsletters Message-ID: <69.ceacd5c.27421643@aol.com> my old newsletters clearly state "not for copy without permission", monty miller is on the net, i think we all owe Monty a great deal for his contribution to the advancement of the kr, this has been kicked around alot, i do know Monty sells back issues ,so i would ass_ u_ me he would like to be contacted, after all we wouldn"t even be building kr's without the help of those that have been active long before we even started building. just my 2 cents. charles robison atlanta, texas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:53:39 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Frank Ross Subject: Re: KR> CONTROL WHEEL/Newsletters Message-ID: <20001114045339.19525.qmail@web4702.mail.yahoo.com> Charles, That issue was before Monty Miller had the KR Newsletter. Ernest Koppe was doing the newsletter then and issues 1 through 87 are on the net at http://www.geocities.com/krnewsletters/ Unfortunately I just went there to see what that page looks like and I can't get it to open. Keep getting some goofy crap about humor. If you go to that site, be forewarned the issues take about a year to open, but they're worth every second. Get a cold one and a sandwhich while you're waiting. And say a big thank you to Ernest Koppe and Mark Lougheed. --- CHOCTAWCWR@aol.com wrote: > my old newsletters clearly state "not for copy > without permission", monty > miller is on the net, i think we all owe Monty a > great deal for his > contribution to the advancement of the kr, this has > been kicked around alot, > i do know Monty sells back issues ,so i would ass_ > u_ me he would like to be > contacted, after all we wouldn"t even be building > kr's without the help of > those that have been active long before we even > started building. just my 2 > cents. > > charles robison > atlanta, texas ===== Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Get organized for the holidays! http://calendar.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 14:53:15 -0800 To: Mike Mims ,krnet@mailinglists.org From: Tracy & Carol O'Brien Subject: Re: KR> Finish Paint techniques Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.20001113145315.0072d2c0@localaccess.com> Netters, I have used the roll and tip painting method on boats for years, as have the Gougeon brothers, the developers of WEST System epoxy. You can roll and tip most paints that will allow you to work a wet edge for at least 60 seconds. I really like using the system with marine enamels: I use the 7" long, 1/8" thick foam rollers that WEST System and System Three sell. I cut these rollers in 1/2 and use them on a 3" roller handle. I pour a small puddle of the enamel in the middle a foot square sheet of plywood and pick up the paint from the plywood. I roll about a 100 square inch area with each roller full. The foam roller will leave bubbles in the enamel which I stroke out with a 2" disposable foam brush, stroking from the dry edge onto the area just conpleted. The bubbles are wonderful on second and third coats, as they allow you to see exactly where you have been! This is also the least wasteful painting method I have ever used. Regards, Tracy O'Brien At 09:13 AM 11/12/2000 -0800, Mike Mims wrote: >Have any of you ever watched Ship Shape TV on >Speedvision? The guy on there just applied the finish >coat on his boat project using a foam roller and a >fine hair paint brush. I am here to tell you that the >finish was better than 75% of the homebuilt airplanes >I have ever seen! Does anyone know what this product >is? I didn't catch the name but I highly recommend >this stuff for those of you who may be spray paint >impaired! It just seemed to he the best option for >someone like myself. No special equipment needed, no >overspray issues, and very durable. > >===== >........| >.......-^- >....-/_____\- >...(O\__o__/O) >...[#]oxxxo[#] >-----Y2K Bug--- > Yes I had one! > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Calendar - Get organized for the holidays! >http://calendar.yahoo.com/ > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 19:43:15 -0600 To: "Frank Ross" , "Mike Mims" , From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> Finish Paint techniques Message-ID: <003501c04ddc$43a4edc0$647239ce@dana-coe> -----Original Message----- From: Frank Ross To: Mike Mims ; krnet@mailinglists.org Date: Sunday, November 12, 2000 2:12 PM Subject: Re: KR> Finish Paint techniques >--- Mike Mims wrote: >> Have any of you ever watched Ship Shape TV on >> Speedvision? The guy on there just applied the >> finish >> coat on his boat project using a foam roller and a >> fine hair paint brush. I am here to tell you that >> the >> finish was better than 75% of the homebuilt >> airplanes >> I have ever seen! Does anyone know what this product >> is? > >Mike, >I'd like to know more about this. >On another note...watching an overpriced video on >composite construction, sanding carbon fiber the dust >particles are electrically conductive and can ruin >electric motors that the dust gets into. Something to >think about... > > > >===== >Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, Be careful of carbon fiber splinters they will work there way though the tissue and emerge some where else. Ron ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 22:43:50 -0800 To: From: "Peter Johnson" Subject: Further to Rolling and Tipping... Message-ID: <002101c04e09$a1437a00$26a5e2d1@peter> ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C04DC3.314C0140 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ned Thomas asked a few questions about what I wrote last night. The = plywood I use to make to make my sanding boards with is 1/4", 3 ply = spruce. This stuff is light, cheap, semi-flexible and readily available = from neighbours who are building things (chortle chortle..!). You could = use anything really, as long as it is smooth, FLAT!, semi-flexible, and = strong enough to take some good beating about! Make sure the handles = are smooth and comfortable and use gloves while sanding. The sandpaper = is just your regular 81/2"x11" sheet size. When using a 'two sheet' = sanding board apply two sheets WITHOUT ANY OVERLAP using a smear of = stationary glue stick just inside of the edge. As for the availability = of 'C' or 'D' weight sandpaper backing, if your hardware store doesn't = have it, look for a better hardware store! When using the sanding boards, use a long, smooth, straight sweep, you = don't want to be sanding over curving humps such as the top of an = airfoil shape if you can help it. Watch the pencil lines disappear to = indicate that sanded enough, and again, be prepared for this to take = very little time! Of course you're much better off to take too little = an amount of time on a first time try so that you have to go back and do = it again, than to spend too much time on a surface and sand right = through the lay-up! That's the purpose of the pencil scribblings all = over the surface, when you see that begin to disappear you know you've = sanded enough. Regarding fillers, and in that same venue, paints, I will wait till = later to describe what I use. I have thought a bit about surface preping. One of the most important = things to ensure a paint job is to ensure a 'flat' surface before you = even begin shaping the foam. Here are a couple of things that can will help you obtain a 'flat' = surface starting at the very beginning: =20 1) Make sure your templates are smooth, and fair. If you have bumps and = irregular lines/curves in your template, make new ones! It is oh so = much easier to shape a little foam or plywood right than it is to shape = a critical cloth/epoxy lay-up. 2) About a year ago someone on the list here described a technique he = used which he called 'vacuumless bagging'. It works! If your foam is = correctly and 'flatly' finished, the next thing to ensure your final = paint job is good is to ensure your lay-up is 'flat'. This 'vacuumless = bagging' technique is wonderfully simple and effective. It consists of = laying the cloth down, wetting it out, laying heavy vapour barrier style = plastic down on the lay-up, and then squeegying (sp?) the epoxy out from = beneath the plastic. This method will provide you with all of the = benefits of vacuum bagging with next to nothing in additional cost or = time. Once the epoxy is squeeged out from beneath the plastic, the = plastic creates a 'seal' on the lay-up which acts like a vacuum and = forces the lay-up to remain tight to the foam. The surface finish is = like that of the plastic which you will peal off after all has set-up. = On flat curved surfaces like a wing or fuse side use heavy plastic. On = compound curved surfaces such as a nicely styled turtle deck, use = drycleaner style plastic so it will conform to the compound curve. = Don't hesitate to get help holding the plastic up and laying it down = without wrinkles. If now help is available, lay the plastic out on the = work dry and jiffy mark a couple of reference lines on it, roll it up, = and when wet lay-up is in place, line up the plastic and unroll it. Do = keep the wrinkles out of it or you will be sanding down high lines of = epoxy and that's a bummer!!! It is important to remember that if your lay-up is rough, or looking = like the hills of Aberdeen, then as you sand you will cut through the = cloth and except for small areas, you are back at the beginning prep'ing = the foam! =20 Before I sign off for the night, here's a suggestion for those who are = one step behind me in building (and I'm only two steps into it!). I = hope this may help someone. To quickly mark the 5/8" pcs that make up = the vertical and diagonal pcs of the fuse side, try the following tool. = Take a pc of wire clothes hanger or welding rod or bicycle spoke or = similar about 5" long and file a sharp, round point into one end about = 1/2" long. Now bend this point about 70 or 80 degrees. Make a small, = comfortable handle from a pc of broom handle or similar about 4" long = and drill a 1/4" dia hole lengthwise in one end. I used hot melt glue = to hold the sharpened wire in the handle leaving the point sticking out = about 2". After nailing the longerons in place I was able to just = eyeball the verts in place while laying across the longerons, and using = the 'hook', I scraped the bottom of the vertical stock by running the = hook along the longeron and scratching the underside of the vertical = stock. After the verticals were cut and weighted down in place I did = the same thing to produce the diagonal pcs. It quickly became a simple = process. I would suggest though that you start cutting the longest = verticals and diagonals first, that way if you do miss-cut, you haven't = made a mistake, you've just pre-cut a shorter pc!=20 mailto:pjohnson@voyageur.ca ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C04DC3.314C0140-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:17:40 -0500 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: The Stones Subject: Re: KR> Further to Rolling and Tipping... Message-ID: <3A112D64.D67A13BE@gnv.fdt.net> Peter Johnson wrote: > > snippage > As for the availability of 'C' or 'D' weight sandpaper backing, if your > hardware store doesn't have it, look for a better hardware store! > > Another possible avenue is to look under the Automotive heading in your yellow pages for body shop supply outlets. Napa comes to mind that carries such materials. Have gotten 40D and 80D in the long sheets from them before when working on the jalopy. Tim S. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 03:11:11 -0500 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Michael Taglieri Subject: urgeon) Message-ID: <20001114.002827.13830.6.MikeT_NYC@juno.com> >(k) Exceptions. > >(1) This section does not require a category and class rating for >aircraft not type certificated as airplanes, rotorcraft, or >lighter-than-air-aircraft, or a class rating for gliders or powered- >lifts. > >(2) The rating limitations of this section do not apply to- >(i) An applicant when taking a practical test given by an examiner; > >(ii) The holder of a student pilot certificate; ? >******************************** and here it is!! ******************** > >(iii) The holder of a pilot certificate when operating an aircraft >under the authority of an experimental or provisional aircraft type >certificate; Of course, the fact that you can legally fly an experimental tailwheel without an endorsement doesn't mean it wouldn't be REAL stupid to try. Of KR first flight reports I've seen, the ones without tailwheel time seem to be the ones that terrify themselves or smash up their planes. Mike Taglieri - miket_nyc@juno.com ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 07:39:26 EST To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: Newsletters Message-ID: <5b.dea02e0.27428c7e@aol.com> In a message dated 11/13/00 11:54:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, kae_ar@yahoo.com writes: << Ernest Koppe was doing the newsletter then and issues 1 through 87 are on the net at http://www.geocities.com/krnewsletters/ >> If you have the newsletter with the wheel diagram in question, you can scan it and post it. We have been given permission by Ernest Koppe to do this to further the KR cause. Monte Miller has decided not to do the same. Dana Overall 2000 KR Gathering host Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************