From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 1 Mar 2002 20:09:24 -0000 Issue 384 Date: Friday, March 01, 2002 12:09 PM krnet Digest 1 Mar 2002 20:09:24 -0000 Issue 384 Topics (messages 9045 through 9064): Free BBQ on Monday at Sun & Fun 9045 by: gpasc 9055 by: virgnvs.juno.com Jabiru engines? 9046 by: Alex Zobell 9047 by: Mark Langford 9059 by: macwood 9062 by: Flibuoy.aol.com Re: What a KR can have you make! 9048 by: larry flesner updated site for australian VW engine 9049 by: Phillip Matheson HAPPI INFO. NEEDED 9050 by: David Hartz Seals 9051 by: Ron Eason Re: aileron counter balance 9052 by: dene.collett Flaps, Belly Board, None of the above. 9053 by: Seifert, Richard E 9054 by: Kenneth L Wiltrout Re: Sun N Fun 2002 9056 by: virgnvs.juno.com 9057 by: Frank Ross Jabiru engines for KRs 9058 by: Andy Silvester Geat Plains 2180 For Sale 9060 by: Stephen P. Glover flaperons 9061 by: Wayne Hartman Posa Pressure? 9063 by: Conley, Paul W. ultralight looks at sport pilot 9064 by: Tony Alderman Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:14:44 +0000 To: From: gpasc Subject: Free BBQ on Monday at Sun & Fun Message-ID: Hey KR Netters: There is also a Free BBQ on Monday, April 8 at the Field. This is our annual Customer Appreciation BBQ. Stop by our booth in Building A for more information and to RSVP. Marti is in charge of the grilling this year! Linda & Steve Bennett Great Plains Aircraft KR1 1/2 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 19:41:07 -0500 To: gpasc@earthlink.net From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Free BBQ on Monday at Sun & Fun Message-ID: <20020228.201117.-360877.3.virgnvs@juno.com> BINGO, a real good deal folks. Bring on the KR's, Virg On Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:14:44 +0000 gpasc writes: > Hey KR Netters: > > There is also a Free BBQ on Monday, April 8 at the Field. This is > our > annual Customer Appreciation BBQ. Stop by our booth in Building A > for more > information and to RSVP. > > Marti is in charge of the grilling this year! > > Linda & Steve Bennett > Great Plains Aircraft > KR1 1/2 > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:12:40 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Alex Zobell Subject: Jabiru engines? Message-ID: <20020228011240.15819.qmail@web13405.mail.yahoo.com> First off thanks to everyone who responded to my earlier post about the safety issues of the KR-2. Recetenly I was looking up possible engines for when I build this plane and found an 80hp Jabiru that looks like it might be a good engine. Does anybody have experience with Jabiru, partuclarly with installing it on a KR-2S? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 19:31:22 -0600 To: From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> Jabiru engines? Message-ID: <015c01c1bff7$a1830470$0100a8c0@cmc3075662a> > like it might be a good engine. Does anybody have > experience with Jabiru, partuclarly with installing it > on a KR-2S? There's a guy in Wisconsin putting a 120hp Jabiru into a KR2S, and using the new airfoil as well. I don't know how far along he is but you should give him a call. The engine is very light for the power. Just when I think I'm gonna have the fastest KR on the planet.... I emailed Alex his phone number, because he's not on the net. Give us a report after you've talked to him. Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:57:07 -0000 To: "Alex Zobell" From: "macwood" Cc: Subject: Re: KR> Jabiru engines? Message-ID: <001b01c1c129$11b6d820$d62f3c3e@tinypc> Last time I was in Ozz, I checked out a flying club in W Australia with a view to getting a ride in a Jabiru. The club told me that they had sold their Jabs as they had problems with the engine. I haven't heard any other complaints about them - check with John Martindale . Regards Mac W UK inal Message ----- From: "Alex Zobell" To: Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 1:12 AM Subject: KR> Jabiru engines? > First off thanks to everyone who responded to my > earlier post about the safety issues of the KR-2. > > Recetenly I was looking up possible engines for when I > build this plane and found an 80hp Jabiru that looks > like it might be a good engine. Does anybody have > experience with Jabiru, partuclarly with installing it > on a KR-2S? > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! > http://greetings.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 12:58:38 EST To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Flibuoy@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Jabiru engines? Message-ID: <90.22040cc0.29b11b4e@aol.com> --part1_90.22040cc0.29b11b4e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable clipped from macwood@tinyworld.co.uk Last time I was in Ozz, I checked out a flying club in W Australia with a view to getting a ride in a Jabiru. The club told me that they had sold their Jabs as they had problems with the engine.=A0=A0 I haven't heard any o= ther complaints about them - check with John Martindale . Regards=A0 =A0 Mac=A0 W=A0=A0 UK=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 I visited Jabiru's website at www.jabiru.co.uk for the first time as a resul= t=20 of this thread. That engine sure seems to be a winner...according to Jabiru=20 of course..and the down side is the dollars. The unknown is serviceability=20 and support I suppose. I know if I could/wanted to afford this egingine I=20 would have that 6 cylinder hanging out front in a heartbeat. If you visit th= e=20 site today's exchange rate is 1 pound =3D $1.46. The weight is the very attractive component here...VW weight for 107=20 horsepower. Well I am off to a casino in March...maybe I will get VERY lucky= .=20 john --part1_90.22040cc0.29b11b4e_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:01:27 -0600 To: From: larry flesner Subject: Re: KR> What a KR can have you make! Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20020227200127.008f3cf0@mail.midwest.net> The KR cockpit is so small that the clipboard interferes >with the stick and/or the passenger. So, I had to build a tiny one >(120x195mm, that is about 4 =BE" x 7 =BD"). >>Serge VIDAL +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I ran out of room in my panel to mount a hand held nav/com and no other place seemed to work well so after several hours of setting in the KR, I came up with the following. I modified a yoke mount and attached it to the back side of the panel. I made a modified flat plate from an old alum cookie sheet. The radio, wired to external antenna and a.c. power swings up completely out of sight behind the panel. After climbing in I simply loosen the thumb knob and the radio swings down between my knees , right in front of the stick. To exit, I simply swing it back behind the panel. I built a slide assy that is hardwired to a.c. power to replace the=20 battery pack. The radio comes out in about 10 seconds if I want to use it elsewhere. What's the old saying? "Necessity is the mother of invention". =20 The antenna I'm using is the one advertised in Sport Aviation. It is a half-dipole and sells for about $150 for a comm. I got mine from the gentleman I bought the Tripacer from. DOES IT EVER WORK GREAT !! I tiewraped it(in the center at the cable attach point) to a cross piece in the turtledeck area. Each end is curved back a bit where it hits the floor and turtledeck. No ground plane needed and I can pick up the ATIS for one airport ten miles away and the VOR and AWOS from another airport five miles away with the KR setting in the garage. That with a used $150 Sporties handheld nav/com !! I'm thrilled. I also made contact with a friend of mine flying his Acro Sport II when he was about fifteen miles out. Larry Flesner P.S. That's why you don't see a radio in the picture of my panel on Mark Jones homepage. That's a transponder in the panel. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:04:33 +1100 To: From: "Phillip Matheson" Subject: updated site for australian VW engine Message-ID: <009101c1bffc$49dd7ac0$0100a8c0@barry> ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C1C058.784C35C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable VW engine centre is starting up in the states. http://www.vw-engines.com/vw-engines/ ???$6000 US ????? Ron Slender , the man to talk to. Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C1C058.784C35C0-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 21:55:16 -0800 (PST) To: Alex Zobell , krnet@mailinglists.org From: David Hartz Subject: HAPPI INFO. NEEDED Message-ID: <20020228055516.13361.qmail@web14704.mail.yahoo.com> CAN ANYONE HELP ME GET A WIRING DIAGRAM FOR A HAPPI 60HP WITH DUAL IGNITION.I RECENTLY BOUGHT THIS MOTOR COMPLETE FROM PROP TO ENGINE MOUNT AND THE GUY HAD LOST THE INFO. PACKET.ANY HELP WOULD BE GREAT. DAVE > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , > NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at > http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:35:25 -0600 To: "krnet" From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Seals Message-ID: <009301c1c075$f12fe8c0$4bdd1f41@Administration> ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C1C043.A1C2BB00 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_008F_01C1C043.A1C2BB00"; type="multipart/alternative" ------=_NextPart_001_008F_01C1C043.A1C2BB00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_002_0090_01C1C043.A1C2BB00" ------=_NextPart_002_0090_01C1C043.A1C2BB00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some of you may find this resource helpful. Plastic and rubber TRIMS and SEALS are highlighted in Trim-Lok's new = catalog. For a free copy call 1-888-874-6565 or visit http://link.abpi.net/l.php?20020228A4 . Ronald R. Eason Sr. President / CEO Ph: 816-468-4091 Fax: 816-468-5465 e-Fax: 240-371-5833 =20 http://www.jrl-engineering.com=20 Our Attitude Makes The Difference! ------=_NextPart_002_0090_01C1C043.A1C2BB00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Some of you may find this resource=20 helpful.
 
 
Plastic and rubber TRIMS and SEALS = are=20 highlighted in Trim-Lok's new catalog.
For a free copy call = 1-888-874-6565 or=20 visit
http://link.abpi.net/l.php?20020228A4
= .

Ronald R. Eason = Sr.
President / CEO
Ph:=20 816-468-4091
Fax: 816-468-5465 e-Fax:=20 240-371-5833

=20

http://www.jrl-engineering.com=20
Our Attitude Makes The = Difference!

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4wMCADs= ------=_NextPart_001_008F_01C1C043.A1C2BB00-- ------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C1C043.A1C2BB00-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:37:35 +0200 To: From: "dene.collett" Subject: Re: KR> aileron counter balance Message-ID: <000001c1c098$0889dfe0$0194cba3@dean> > The only way you know they DON'T work is when they flutter, and then it's > too crowded to bend over an kiss your ___ goodbye. > > Ron Freiberger... Ron: Thats how I know they do work perfectly, my but is still there. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:40:33 -0800 To: "'KRnet'" From: "Seifert, Richard E" Subject: Flaps, Belly Board, None of the above. Message-ID: <9BA7A06DA8127B4B925954F3F8705D349F817A@XCH-SW-09.sw.nos.boeing.com> There has been some really good discussion on this subject, which confirms my contention "the choice of which to use is basically builder preference" Here are some things that influenced my decision. 1. The KR2 without some drag inducing devise does not slow down quickly. (Confirmed by testing) 2. Flaps do induce drag, but also provide lift. 3. Flaps on a tail wheel, retract KR2 are very close to the runway. (Even more lift, and possibility of damage due to rocks kicked up by the gear) 4. Belly board creates drag but no lift. (Mounted near center of lift, it kicks the nose down, yet is clear from rock damage) My preference was the Belly board for my retract KR2 and after years of experimenting I am still happy with it and would not consider changing it. If I were building another configuration KR2 I would go through the decision process and maybe come up with a different answer. There is no cut and dried correct answer for all KR's. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 18:34:57 -0500 To: richard.e.seifert@boeing.com From: Kenneth L Wiltrout Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Flaps, Belly Board, None of the above. Message-ID: <20020228.183457.-442621.1.klw1953@juno.com> Can anyone explain how the bellyboard is activated. I would like to install one some day but I'm not sure how the linkage should look or be mounted.----------Thanks On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:40:33 -0800 "Seifert, Richard E" writes: > There has been some really good discussion on this subject, which > confirms > my contention "the choice of which to use is basically builder > preference" > Here are some things that influenced my decision. > 1. The KR2 without some drag inducing devise does not slow down > quickly. > (Confirmed by testing) > 2. Flaps do induce drag, but also provide lift. > 3. Flaps on a tail wheel, retract KR2 are very close to the runway. > (Even > more lift, and possibility of damage due to rocks kicked up by the > gear) > 4. Belly board creates drag but no lift. (Mounted near center of > lift, it > kicks the nose down, yet is clear from rock damage) > > My preference was the Belly board for my retract KR2 and after years > of > experimenting I am still happy with it and would not consider > changing it. > If I were building another configuration KR2 I would go through the > decision > process and maybe come up with a different answer. There is no cut > and > dried correct answer for all KR's. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 19:30:40 -0500 To: kae_ar@yahoo.com From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Sun N Fun 2002 Message-ID: <20020228.201117.-360877.1.virgnvs@juno.com> Same this year!! NO KR BOOTH. Virg On Wed, 27 Feb 2002 08:27:06 -0800 (PST) Frank Ross writes: > --- virgnvs@juno.com wrote: > > Tues AM Forum, PM Dinner, Virg > > What Virg is trying to say is that there are usually a > LOT of KR folk dropping by the KR Booth saying hello > to Jeanette Rand and Virg, who is almost always at the > booth trying to get young cuties to give him a hug. > The amazing thing is, he's usually successful. > Anyway, the KR DINNER is Tuesday evening, last year > was at the Holiday Inn a few miles east of the field. > You can get directions at the KR Booth. Don't miss it, > you'll meet a LOT of KR builders and flyers, many who > aren't on the net. > The forum is hosted by Jeanette Rand and it is on Tues > AM. Last year I got to meet Jeanette and her daughter, > Susan, both the nicest ladies you could want to meet. > I met Virg too. > You might find this hard to believe, but he doesn't > say much. > > ===== > Frank Ross, San Antonio, TX, > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! > http://greetings.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 19:56:42 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Frank Ross Subject: Sun N Fun 2002 Message-ID: <20020301035642.58782.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> --- virgnvs@juno.com wrote: > Same this year!! NO KR BOOTH. Virg Virg, Are you saying that there won't be a Rand Robinson KR Booth at Sun N Fun this year? Will Jeanette Rand be there? Thanks PS, I deleted a message from you with an attachment without opening it. Was it my lottery ticket? Frank __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 23:24:12 -0500 To: From: "Andy Silvester" Subject: Jabiru engines for KRs Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C1C0AF.07DCB880 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit All, A friend and KR builder forwarded me your enquiry about Jabiru engines for the KR2 / KR2-S. These mailing lists are not necessarily the place for a lengthy sales pitch, but we’re the Southeastern US Dealer for Jabiru engines and aircraft kits, and I’ll be pleased to help with any Jabiru related queries, either on the list or via individual enquiries. I have recently sold a Jabiru 3300 120hp, six cylinder engine to a KR2-S builder in Jasper, AL, and am aware of a few others who have decided on this engine. Please see our web site for more information, or ask me; but briefly, the Jabiru 3300 provides 120hp at 3300 rpm (direct drive, air cooled, all billet machined), and about 110 hp at 2750rpm, weighs 180 lb (ramp weight), comes with muffler, starter motor, ram air cooling ducts, 25A alternator and regulator, and costs $10,700.00, fob Naples, FL. There is a comprehensive sales and service network via 3 USA dealers, each of which stock spares and can service engines up to TBO. We’ll be at Sun N Fun stand no. LD 5 outside. And lastly, yes, the Jabiru engines are ideal for the KR2 / KR2-S, but by all means ask others who are using them or building with them. I’ll try to put people in touch with Jabiru owners if required. Andy Silvester Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc. 2003 Mainsail Drive Naples, FL 34114 Tel: (941) 394 6800 Fax: (941) 430 2063 email: info@suncoastjabiru.com www.suncoastjabiru.com (Original message) ……like it might be a good engine. Does anybody have > experience with Jabiru, partuclarly with installing it > on a KR-2S? There's a guy in Wisconsin putting a 120hp Jabiru into a KR2S, and using the new airfoil as well. I don't know how far along he is but you should give him a call. The engine is very light for the power. Just when I think I'm gonna have the fastest KR on the planet.... I emailed Alex his phone number, because he's not on the net. Give us a report after you've talked to him. Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C1C0AF.07DCB880-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:13:16 -0800 To: From: "Stephen P. Glover" Subject: Geat Plains 2180 For Sale Message-ID: <001101c1c13b$fef93260$c18afea9@IntelliSpec> ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C1C0F8.F0B216B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Netters, I have a Great Plains conversion with Force One prop hub. Approximately = 100 hours. Dual ignition (Mag with electronic backup). Ellison Carb = included. Revmaster oil cooler. Deihl accessory case with geared starter = and alternator. Must sell ASAP to finance another KR project. No = reasonable offer refused. Call or e-mail for more info. $2350.00 OBO Mission Viejo CA USA. = Telephone: 949-888-0847/ 714-293-9787. -- Posted 1 March 2002 Regards, Steve Glover KR-1 Builder/KR-2 Re-builder Mission Viejo, Ca. n925sg@earthlink.net ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C1C0F8.F0B216B0-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:19:22 -0800 (PST) To: KR Net From: Wayne Hartman Subject: flaperons Message-ID: <20020301171922.61751.qmail@web14910.mail.yahoo.com> Hello all, A new subscriber and KR builder. I need info on how to install flaperons in the KR. I saw an article with drawings somewhere in the KR site, but cant find it again.. Can someone direct me to the link with how to hookup flaperons?? Thanks. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 14:09:43 -0500 To: "'krnet@mailinglists.org'" From: "Conley, Paul W." Subject: Posa Pressure? Message-id: <070AE2805DAC5F409222E15F3FCA421602B4908E@uuhil-354> --Boundary_(ID_SEIJD5sYPaDm5Vi4cF81Vw) Content-type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Hi all, I have been looking in the archives, but for some reason by browser keeps taking a siesta.... So, I'll bother everyone's grey matter with the question.... Question: I am building a KR2 w/ 2.0 L 914 engine. The carb I have is a Posa. I know the device is usually gravity fed, but, how about a pump with a pressure regulator to keep things constant with different fuel levels??? Or, has the gravity from the fuselage tank worked well enough that this has never came up?? Thanks! P.S. I realize it is necessary to turn fuel off to avoid the flooding... This on/off valve would therefore be after the reg.... Thank you, Paul Conley LAN-WAN Engineer, Global Hosting UUNET, an MCI WorldCom Company (614) 723-7647 / pconley@wcom.net --Boundary_(ID_SEIJD5sYPaDm5Vi4cF81Vw)-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 15:07:12 -0800 To: "Conley, Paul W." , From: "Tony Alderman" Subject: ultralight looks at sport pilot Message-ID: <000c01c1c175$d3122280$fd9ff7a5@computer> I thought you all might be interested in this Tony ********************************************** Federal Register Docket No. FAA-2001-11133 Rule: Certification of Aircraft and Airmen for the Operation of Light- Sport Aircraft Sent: Via Fascimile (202) 493-2251 From: B.J.Moore P.O. Box 176 Milford, Utah 84751 Date: February 19, 2002 To Whom It May Concern: The proposed NPRM for the Certification of Aircraft and Airmen for the Operation of Light-Sport Aircraft is incomplete and therefore should be rescinded until other alternatives are evaluated and the most appropriate selected. The NPRM only discusses two alternatives, providing no consideration or discussion of other possibilities. In such a complex and ambitious rule, it appears that careful consideration should be given to other more potentially cost- effective alternatives that can provide the same, or even greater benefit to the general public, maintain safety, and receive much more widespread acceptance from the ultralight and general aviation communities. One such alternative will be presented herein. On page 5397 of the Federal Register, two alternatives are presented. They are: Alternative 1. Status Quo - Strictly Enforce Current Regulations. Alternative 2. Proposed Rule. The "problem" is not stated as such, but is outlined under the initial paragraph under "Status Quo Alternative" same page, stating that the alternative presents a "situation in which the FAA would issue training exemptions from part 103 indefinitely. This would perpetuate "rulemaking by exemption" which does not qualify as a viable alternative." It is then stated that the FAA issued the exemptions under the assumption that they would soon be superceded by rulemaking, thus providing justification for exemption issuance. There is no need to argue this position. In fact the FAA is to be commended for the issuance of the training exemptions, as ultimately many lives must have been saved. Not only have lives been saved within the legal 103 community, but also appropriate training has been provided to those operators who have operated outside of Part 103 and the exemptions there to. These include the "Fat Ultralights" as is termed and described in the paragraphs that follow those quote above, on page 5397. I do however; desire to argue that the proposed rule is not the only viable alternative to the status quo. I also desire to argue that the proposed rule will gain little, if any acceptance from many of the operators of fat ultralights, and exempted trainers. In doing so, the following is presented as a more desirable alternative, one that will gain much wider acceptance among the ultralight and general aviation contingents. This alternative will be presented herein as Alternative 3 (other alternatives may also be more beneficial). Alternative 3. Alternative 3 is a request to amend and revise the FAA regulations for the recreational pilot certificate (rec pilot). In addition, Alternative 3 includes revision of Part 103 to incorporate current exemption limitations by rule, and allowance of qualifying ultralight organizations to continue to administer such. Further development of Alternative 3 needs outlining. I will not attempt to write an entire ruling, as has been done in the case of this NPRM, however, I will try to touch on as many issues that immediately surface in it's regards. Alternative 3, Changes to the Recreational Pilot Rating For rec pilot, it should first be noted that some changes to this certification are already outlined in the NPRM, mainly for operation in classes B, C, and D, airspace. This is commendable. The NPRM states that since rec pilot was initially instated in 1989, that just 638 certificates had been issued, and that only 338 were active in January 2001. The NPRM also states by admission that "Despite the efforts discussed above to address sport and recreation general aviation needs, those rules, for various reasons, have not achieved the regulatory goals we set out to achieve." In addition, the NPRM states "Neither the recreational pilot certificate nor the primary category airworthiness certificate regulations have accommodated the sport and recreational flying community." Although the goals for rec pilot are not specifically stated, it appears that the attempt was made to accommodate flying for fun, yet at a more reasonable cost, with more restrictions as a tradeoff for less training. Additionally, an apparent goal of rec pilot was to provide a stepping-stone for pilots to upgrade into higher certifications. These goals are admirable, and appear to be the same goals intended for the current NPRM. No further discussion of rec pilot's failure of acceptance is given except the statement that it was "for various reasons". Not requiring any conjecture, the primary reason for limited participation in rec pilot is that the difference in cost between rec and private pilot rating were so negligible, that the added privileges of the full private pilot rating was much more desirable. Therefore, it did not generate significant participation from those seeking cost-effective leisure and licensure to fly. Specifically, the initial intent of rec pilot was to develop growth and participation in light aviation. Apparently, last minute changes were made to the final rule to eliminate the one feature that would have distinguished rec pilot from the private rating and would have made all of the difference in the world as to it's acceptance and participation. This was the last minute inclusion that all rec pilots would be required to obtain the FAA medical. Aside from removing the medical requirement in favor of a driver's license, self-certifying medical, a few other minor changes to rec pilot are needed to achieve its wide acceptance. Some are those same limitations proposed to be changed in the current NPRM. Others areas needing revision are the 50-mile cross country limitation, and the altitude limitation. I have submitted a separate comment letter on the altitude issue, as this is common to the proposed limitations on the sport pilot rating. Alternative 3, Changes to Part 103, Ultralight Regulations. We have heard it said many times that we should not reopen Part 103 as it may be jeopardized. Interestingly, there is a cursory reopening of rec pilot, with out its loss or jeopardy. The simple fact of the matter is best demonstrated within the proposed NPRM that states: "103 covers ultralight activities, an increasing number of ultralight vehicles are operating outside the current regulations. This is because the vehicles either exceed the part 103 ultralight weight limit (254 pounds) or they have two seats. For many operators, installing any new equipment or using new materials (some of which increase the level of safety) causes the vehicle to exceed the weight requirements of part 103. Seeing the need for training to reduce accidents, manufacturers have built two-place training vehicles and organizations have established programs to qualify ultralight flight instructors. However, these vehicles do not meet the current definition of ultralight vehicle, and are not manufactured, certificated, or maintained to a standard. So, while the FAA currently does not require certification for ultralight vehicle operators, flight instructors, or vehicles, we issued exemptions to allow these larger ultralights to be used for training, but not for other sport or recreational flight." By admission, in the above statement and in other areas of the NPRM, the FAA Recognizes that the vehicles operating outside of the limitations of 103 are still "Ultralights" Recognizes that exceedences of the limitations have resulted in added safety. That the operation of 2 seat "vehicles" have contributed to the added safety and training. Acknowledges the existence of ultralights that are over weight in statements referring to them as "fat ultralights". Finds fault in the fact that the two seat trainers and fat ultralights are not "manufactured, certificated, nor maintained to a standard" yet conversely finds acclamation in the added safety that has resulted from their existence. Anyone who reads, and has worked with Part 103, either as a pilot flying a legal, a fat, or training vehicle, knows that Part 103 has some significant problems, rendering it as an unsafe rule in and of itself. These include: The limitation of carrying 5 gallons of fuel, which ultimately may result in off field landings, potential accidents, injuries, and fatalities. The weight limitation of 254 pounds, wherein safety is attained in the inclusion of parts that add weight, such as gauges, structural airframe improvements, brakes, and higher weight and horsepower engines with dual ignition. In contrast to the participation in rec pilot, there are over 1,300 current UFI's, BFI's, and AFI's (instructors) operating training vehicles under the training exemptions. Admittedly, much of the participation in these programs is by pilots who desire the less restricted flight standards of Part 103. Many do not train or instruct at all. However, we must note that the primary reason for participation in such is not because it there is fear that these vehicles are unsafe, and not "manufactured, certificated, nor maintained to a standard." It is because it represents a less regulated flying regime, not requiring the FAA medical. These pilots (and students) know, understand, and willingly accept the "perceived" safety risks involved in non-certificated vehicles that do not meet FAA standards. They also willingly accept and understand the responsibility of maintaining the safety of these vehicles. Safety Considerations I often preach how much more safe it is to fly and operate my ultralight trainer in discussing the following aspects: The vehicle receives a very near equivalent of an annual inspection each time it is flown. All parts are accessible and available for direct inspection prior to every flight. The pilot is responsible for the safe operation and maintenance of the aircraft and does not have to trust some airline pilot, or maintenance technician, who may be recovering from an alcoholic binge, is unstable, of poor health, or who knows little or nothing about the workings and intricacies of these little airplanes. The glide ratios are high, providing ample opportunity to find landing options in the event of an engine out scenario when operated correctly. We carry less fuel, which minimizes the potential of ending up as a fireball in the event of an accident Simplicity in design. There are less things to go wrong with a simpler airplane than in the more complex designs not found in the ultralight arena. There is less inertial force due to lower weights, and slower speeds, which makes accidents more survivable. This is an attempt to demonstrate that regulations, manufacturing, and certification standards, do not necessarily create a safer environment. These mean nothing to the perception of "added safety" to those of us who fly and maintain ultralights. It is a safe activity, and those who fly these vehicles are able to maintain and demonstrate an impressive safety record, as is evidenced by the exemption program. I would refer to information obtained from the Canadian Transport Authority. It appears that the proposed FAA Sport Pilot rule closely emulates Canada's rules for what they define as ultralights. During the period from 1987 to 1996, Canada's ultralight community demonstrated a safety record of 732 aircraft registered per fatal accident per year. Their higher regulated general aviation counterparts experienced a safety record of 450 aircraft registered per fatal accident per year over the same time period. If my math is correct, this represents Canadian ultralights having a 63% more safe record than their general aviation aircraft. One of the principle differences between Canadian general aviation and Canadian ultralight regulations are that pilots and owners of Ultralight Aircraft pilots by regulation are wholly and entirely responsible for the maintenance and airworthiness of their aircraft. This demonstrates that increased regulation does not necessarily increase public safety. Under alternative 3, it is proposed that the exemptions to Part 103 be eliminated, but that the guidelines and administration of such be incorporated into Part 103. The current exemption limits are to be used as the guidelines for amending the rule. These include operation of single seat ultralights with up to 10 gallons, a maximum stall speed of 35 knots, maximum level flight of 75 knots, and a maximum empty weight of 496 lbs. This is appropriate as the increased safety record of the ultralight community can be demonstrated within the exempted vehicle records. In addition to the expanded limitations, the rule should also incorporate authorization of qualified ultralight organizations to authorize and license two-seat and training operations. As the NPRM stands, there is no consideration for towing of hang gliders, or for instruction of powered paragliders in tandem instruction. The qualifications of these programs would have to be developed, but would be similar to existing requirements for the BFI ratings. Such organizations would be subject to annual FAA audits, and record keeping requirements. A revised 103 should incorporate some statement that those desiring to fly vehicles over the current 103 (not the exemption) limitations will be required to train and earn "pilot status" for operation of such vehicles from an ultralight organization. Membership in qualifying ultralight organizations will be required. Audits shall be performed to assure membership fees and dues are reasonable, appropriate records are kept, and that the ultralight organizations remain and qualify for non-profit tax status as defined by the Internal Revenue Service. Aircraft that do not meet the limitations of the expanded 103 shall be allowed a grace period of 36 months to become registered as experimental aircraft and pilots who operate such will have 36 months to obtain the enhanced rec pilot rating. Ultralight vehicles that are fat, fast, or otherwise do not meet the limitations of the current 103 shall be allowed a grace period of up to 24 months to become registered in and enrolled in an authorized ultralight organization. Ramp checks and enforcement of these enhanced regulations by the FAA will meet much further acceptance. FAA enforcement of the enhanced rules will be key to the success of any new rule. Benefits of Alternative 3. I have read and am sympathetic to many of the comments that have been submitted so far in regards to the proposed NPRM from pilots who desire inclusion of aircraft that do not meet the limitations of light sport aircraft. The fact is, that no matter where the lines are drawn on weight, speed, consensus standards, etc, there will always be those pilots and aircraft that will be left out because of the rule. Perhaps the most striking benefit of Alternative 3 is that no aircraft will be left out. The benefits of Alternative 3 include, but are not limited to: Safety will be at least the same if not greater than the status quo, which has been demonstrated, and is acceptable. Alternative 3 is a no-cost or low-cost alternative. FAA expense and effort in these regards would be enforcement and annual auditing of ultralight organizations. Ultralights, whether fat, legal, or trainers can continue to be defined and operate as such. Aircraft that do not meet the limitations of an expanded 103 can be registered and flown as experimental aircraft. Widespread acceptance throughout the general aviation and ultralight communities. Alternative 3 provides an acceptable niche for all aircraft and all pilots. An alternative for certification of pilots who desire to fly faster heavier aircraft outside of expanded 103 limitations is provided in the revised rec pilot certification, and is readily attainable. Such aircraft do not fit the definition of ultralight, nor ultralight trainers. They do not fit the limitations of such, and therefore should be required to obtain certification. Opportunities will exist for 103 pilots to fly safer vehicles as well as adding requirements for those who fly heavier ultralights to enroll in training programs that will promote and enhance safety. Enhanced safety at airports over other alternatives. Powered Parachute operators really have not desire to fly into class B, C, and D, airport environments, and rarely operate from airfields. Inclusion of such aircraft into traffic patterns at airports could have safety ramifications. It appears the only reason these vehicles were included into the proposed NPRM is because they cannot meet the current weight requirement limitations of Part 103. Participation in rec pilot will increase dramatically. FAA enforcement of the limitations is encouraged and will receive greater acceptance. There will be no need for creation of new categories and training of neither light sport airmen nor light sport aircraft. No need for implementation of the complexities contained in the NPRM. Much of what is proposed in the NPRM appears to assume that training courses for airmen and maintenance will be voluntary, where this may actually not be the case, creating another non-participation rule. Requires less administration by the FAA and is an opportunity for private, non-profit administration. Ultralights remain as ultralights. General aviation and experimental aircraft also remain as such. Alternative 3 is superior to alternatives 1 and 2 as presented in the NPRM. In summary, allow me to draw the following analogy. When building a bridge across a ravine, it is always more effective to build out from each embankment wherein a firm foundation can be fastened. From there the bridge is built out to meet and join somewhere in the middle. Alternative 3 as presented herein does just that, building rec pilot from the general aviation foundation, as well as the expansion of 103 from the ultralight abutment, so that they meet fairly and equitably in the middle. The proposed NPRM for sport pilot fits this analogy as a plank, loosely dropped into place that spans the gorge. It forces many to cross who are otherwise unwilling. It provides a path for those who are desirous to get to the other side, but even these may not be sure of the capability of the board to provide adequate support. Other alternatives such as continuing the exemption programs by incorporation into the 103 rule, but tightening the requirements for such, as well as enactment of sport pilot as proposed could also be sufficient. However, I do not put as much credence in such an alternative to meet acceptance as well as Alternative 3. The FAA's consideration of this alternative is justified, and warrants attention. Please give it careful consideration. The FAA may find as I have that this is a preferred alternative and is in the best interest of the general public. Sincerely: B. J. Moore, P.E. Civil Engineer ASC BFI #BUT00521 -- Tony Alderman Durham NC t-hawk@mindspring.com ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************