From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 9 May 2002 13:21:47 -0000 Issue 424 Date: Thursday, May 09, 2002 6:22 AM krnet Digest 9 May 2002 13:21:47 -0000 Issue 424 Topics (messages 9996 through 10021): Re: Re:Wing attach fittings 9996 by: Ron Eason 9997 by: RONALD.FREIBERGER 9999 by: Livingstone, Danny (DJ) 10004 by: ROBERT COOPER 10005 by: Ron Eason 10006 by: Ron Eason 10009 by: Robert Stone Re: AeroPoxy Filler 9998 by: Peg and Mike Meyer Metal work. Long 10000 by: Dana Overall Re: Diehl gear 10001 by: Jerry Mahurin 10002 by: Mark Jones 10003 by: Charles Buddy Midkiff Re: flutter / Bingalis books 10007 by: Jim Sellars Re: Fiberglass/instruments 10008 by: clappw.bellsouth.net 10010 by: Mark Jones 10011 by: Larry A. Capps Test 10012 by: Brian Woodhams Other Plywood Types 10013 by: Peter Johnson looking at buying a KR2 10014 by: Brian Woodhams Da Mountaintop:-) 10015 by: Dana Overall Re: Belly board 10016 by: David McKelvey Oshkosh 10017 by: Jim Faughn Boiling plywood 10018 by: M&C Pushrods 10019 by: John and Janet Martindale pushrod drawings 10020 by: John and Janet Martindale 10021 by: Ron Eason Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 7 May 2002 21:49:31 -0500 To: "Jerry @ charter.net" , , From: "Ron Eason" Cc: Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-ID: <002a01c1f63a$fb7e9ec0$95621e41@Administration> The KR parts are not CNC technology. KRRon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry @ charter.net" To: ; Cc: Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 12:31 AM Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings > I said I wasn't going there, but..... > > Ever hear of a wing falling off a KR.... I have personally seen broken outer > spars with the wing attach assembly still together; and it had not pulled > out of either spar either. By the way, one of these was held together with > the spacer arrangement also..... > > Back into the foxhole.... > > Jerry Mahurin > Lugoff, SC > See our KR2 at http://kr-builder.org > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 6:51 PM > Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings > > > > Show the reciept from RR, Methinks he oversteps his authority. > > Many KR's flying W/ RR supplied fittings. > > Virg > > > > On Tue, 7 May 2002 20:06:13 -0400 Joseph H Horton > > writes: > > > > > > KR Netters' > > > It was interesting to see all the talk on wing attach > > > fittings. My Tech > > > counciler was out to check out my progress yesterday and the wing > > > attach > > > fittings bothered him to no end. He sad that he would have designed > > > > > > something different. ( I didn't ask him to expand on that) He > > > questioned > > > the material if it was 4130, was it normalized after machining. He > > > said > > > that I should have radiused all the edges and polished. He was > > > concerned > > > about inbrittlement at the edges as you can still see how they were > > > sheared. And then I should have cad plated them. He also questioned > > > the > > > method of attachment that was just discussed. His only somewhat > > > positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN > > > bolt > > > would. BTW the wing attach fittings that I have installed were > > > purchased > > > from Rand Robinson in '97. The Tech also said that I would need > > > documtation on the fittings for the DAR. Any thoughts on any of > > > these > > > comments. Thanks -- Joe Horton > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > > > all" > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 2002 23:27:05 -0400 To: "Joseph H Horton" , From: "RONALD.FREIBERGER" Subject: RE: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-ID: Sheared edges are a no-no. Also, have the material checked for hardness to see if it's even possibly 4130. Cadmium plating is no longer common due to environmental issues. Knowing this critical component is right is more important to you than it is to the DAR. Ron Freiberger... mailto:ron.martha@mindspring.com -----Original Message----- From: Joseph H Horton [mailto:joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 8:06 PM To: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings KR Netters' It was interesting to see all the talk on wing attach fittings. My Tech counciler was out to check out my progress yesterday and the wing attach fittings bothered him to no end. He sad that he would have designed something different. ( I didn't ask him to expand on that) He questioned the material if it was 4130, was it normalized after machining. He said that I should have radiused all the edges and polished. He was concerned about inbrittlement at the edges as you can still see how they were sheared. And then I should have cad plated them. He also questioned the method of attachment that was just discussed. His only somewhat positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN bolt would. BTW the wing attach fittings that I have installed were purchased from Rand Robinson in '97. The Tech also said that I would need documtation on the fittings for the DAR. Any thoughts on any of these comments. Thanks -- Joe Horton --------------------------------------------------------------------- To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 08:37:24 +0200 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: "Livingstone, Danny (DJ)" Subject: RE: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-ID: > KR Netters' > It was interesting to see all the talk on wing attach fittings. My > Tech > counciler was out to check out my progress yesterday and the wing attach > fittings bothered him to no end. > --------------snip------------------ Joseph You don't need new WAF's you need a new tech. councilor! Just my opinion. Danny Livingstone Sasolburg South Africa ********************************************************************** This e-mail and its attachments, if any, are intended only for use by the named addressee(s) and may contain information that is legally privileged, confidential, or both. If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are strictly prohibited from disseminating, distributing or copying this email and its attachments, if any. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender and permanently delete the original and any copies of this e-mail, its attachments, and any printed copies of any of them. ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 13:27:00 -0400 To: , From: "ROBERT COOPER" Cc: "krnet" Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1F694.08DA4700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 His only somewhat > positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN > bolt would. =20 In Gene Byrds crash one of the WAF bolts was shered and the aft center sp= ar was crackes but the WAF is fine. Jack Cooper > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1F694.08DA4700-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 10:36:23 -0700 To: , , "ROBERT COOPER" From: "Ron Eason" CC: "krnet" Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-Id: <200205081036.AA6554002@jrl-engineering.com> Did Ken Rand go to all the fuss over these fittings? I think not, he just made them with hand tools, did'nt he? KRRon ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "ROBERT COOPER" Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 13:27:00 -0400 > > > >His only somewhat >> positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN >> bolt would. >In Gene Byrds crash one of the WAF bolts was shered and the aft center spar was crackes but the WAF is fine. >Jack Cooper >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply >> all" >> >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> >> See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ >> >> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 10:36:24 -0700 To: , , "ROBERT COOPER" From: "Ron Eason" CC: "krnet" Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-Id: <200205081036.AA15139154@jrl-engineering.com> Did Ken Rand go to all the fuss over these fittings? I think not, he just made them with hand tools, did'nt he? KRRon ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "ROBERT COOPER" Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 13:27:00 -0400 > > > >His only somewhat >> positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN >> bolt would. >In Gene Byrds crash one of the WAF bolts was shered and the aft center spar was crackes but the WAF is fine. >Jack Cooper >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply >> all" >> >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> >> See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ >> >> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 14:15:13 -0500 To: , , , "ROBERT COOPER" From: "Robert Stone" Cc: "krnet" Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings Message-ID: <001d01c1f6c4$aefca3a0$05d81a18@hot.rr.com> Netters: For those of you who are interested, Ken Rand did make his own WAF The wide and narrow forward and aft fittings were cut on a table saw and the holes were drilled on a drill press. Ken used a single bolt and spacer between fittings on the KR-1 and the one bolt per attach points with washers on the KR-2. I have never heard of a failure of either method. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, TX rstone4@hot.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Eason" To: ; ; "ROBERT COOPER" Cc: "krnet" Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 12:36 PM Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Re:Wing attach fittings > Did Ken Rand go to all the fuss over these fittings? I think not, he just made them with hand tools, did'nt he? > > KRRon > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: "ROBERT COOPER" > Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 13:27:00 -0400 > > > > > > > > >His only somewhat > >> positive coment was that the 4130 would proably fail before any AN > >> bolt would. > >In Gene Byrds crash one of the WAF bolts was shered and the aft center spar was crackes but the WAF is fine. > >Jack Cooper > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > >> all" > >> > >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >> > >> See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > >> > >> > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 May 2002 23:07:46 -0500 To: Daniel Heath , "Krnet@Mailinglists.Org" From: Peg and Mike Meyer Subject: Re: KR> AeroPoxy Filler Message-id: <00cd01c1f645$e923d320$6c8afea9@o0c8u6> Dan: Try some isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol) - I've had excellent success making a durable,easy to spread filler using aeropoxy, micro, and about 2-3% alcohol. Try a few test swatches. Mike Meyer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel Heath" To: "Krnet@Mailinglists.Org" Sent: Sunday, May 05, 2002 4:45 PM Subject: KR> AeroPoxy Filler > I am using the AeroPoxy Lite, Lightweight epoxy filler. I was told via the > net, that it should spread like frosting. This stuff is so thick that it > spreads more like play dough. There are no directions on the label. There > was a web address of www.aeropoxy.com but no one is home, page not found. > > Does anyone know if there is something that this can be cut with to make it > thinner. I think it would be really good stuff it were not so thick. > > Thanks, > > > Daniel R. Heath > > See our KR2 at: > > http://kr-builder.org > > See our EAA Chapter 242 at: > > WWW.EAA242.ORG > > > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.325 / Virus Database: 182 - Release Date: 2/19/2002 > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 May 2002 08:01:54 -0400 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: "Dana Overall" Subject: Metal work. Long Message-ID: Gang, I've kind of bit my tongue on this for a couple of weeks but feel some clarification needs to extended. Someone posted WAF build technique without ever mentioning deburring and radiusing. I'm just using the WAF as an example, since there is much fabricating and drilling involved. Any, and said any, metal work that has been cut, punched or drilled needs to be deburred. A cut first involves removing all machine work. This can be done by the use of a vixen file, file, or 300 grit followed by a scotchbrite pad or wheel, 400 grit or so on. The edge should be brought to a polished state. Now you need to radius the edges. This can be done by a burnishing tool or you file again. This radius again needs to be polished. All drilled holes need to be deburred using a deburring tool or oversized drill bit that does to chatter. A deburring tool works best. Please do not bench grind the edges and say that is good enough for KR. Every, every manufactured edge needs to be deburred. Sharp or rough edges, corners, and scratches can cause stress concentrations which will gratly increase the possibility of local failure. Any sheared edge, whether sheared by hand or machine, has sharp corners and has a burr on one edge. A good test for the edge finish of aluminum is to run your finger over it. If you can't feel any roughness and there is no chance of drawing blood, the finish is OK. Deburring is a time consuming chore. The finishing procedure will constitute a sizable portion (if not the majority) of fabrication time. If it takes 3 hours to drill the holes, plan on 6 hours to deburr. If you think I'm kidding, just see how much time it takes to make it right. Do they give any awards for seeing how fast you can do something...........not in building airplanes. I know this is a little "stand on the soapbox" but it is very, very important that you don't see just how fast you can do something. It is very, very important that you see just how "right" you can make something. Just because it looks the part doesn't make it the part. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY http://rvflying.tripod.com _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 May 2002 08:52:54 -0400 To: "krnet" From: "Jerry Mahurin" Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear Message-ID: 'Scuse me folks..... I guess that my memory is going..... I have mounted two sets of Diehl taildragger gear but only one tri gear; and I did not recall any diffrences in the gear..... Thanx Mark for catching that..... I knew I shouldn't have talked so much....... Jerry Mahurin Lugoff, SC http://kr-builder.org On Tue, 7 May 2002 21:47:02 -0500 "Mark Jones" wrote: >Wrong, the sets are different for tail dragger and >tri-gear arrangements. I >have the Diehl Plans in my hands and here is a paragraph >from his plans: > >The gear legs are shipped precut and chamfered. The >taildragger conversion >mounts the main gear on the forward side of the main >spar with castings >bolted on just outside the fuselage sides. The gear legs >angle forward. The >tri-gear mounts the gear legs on the aft side of the main >spar with the legs >angling back. The tail dragger version of the gear leg >has a straight >leading edge from the top to the bottom.The tri-gear >version has a crook on >both sides of the leg. The arrow points forward. > >Mark Jones (N886MJ) >Wales, WI USA >E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com >Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at >http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Jerry @ charter.net" >To: "krnet" >Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 12:20 AM >Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear > > >> The main gear and castings and gear legs are the same >>whether it is a tail >> dragger or tri(cycle). The only difference is how you >>arrange the parts >and >> which side of the spar that you mount it on; and which >>side you put the >soda >> straw in for the brake lines.... The parts are all the >>same..... (I >> think.....) >> >> As virg sez.... Yer makin me talk too much..... >> >> Jerry Mahurin >> Lugoff, SC >> See our KR2 at http://kr-builder.org >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: "krnet" >> Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 5:33 PM >> Subject: KR> Diehl gear >> >> >> > Some one was asking if the Diehl gear was the same for >>taildragger and >> nose >> > gear. I got the off the Diehl website. >> > >> > The Gear legs are shipped precut and the edges are >>chamferred. The >> > taildragger conversion mounts the main gear on the >>forward side of the >> main >> > spar with castings bolted on just outside the fuselage >>sides. The gear >> legs >> > angle forward. The tri-gear mounts the gear legs on >>the aft side of the >> main >> > spar with the legs angling back.>>> The tail dragger >>version of the gear >> leg >> > has a straight leading edge from top to bottom. The >>tri-gear version has >a >> > crook on both sides of the leg. <<>forward. >> > >> > Rgds., Bob Roe >> > >> > >> > >> > >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , >>NOT "reply all" >> > >> > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> > For additional commands, e-mail: >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> > >> > See the KRNet archives at >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ >> > >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT >>"reply all" >> >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> >> See the KRNet archives at >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ >> > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 08:11:07 -0500 To: "Jerry Mahurin" , "krnet" From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear Message-ID: <001701c1f691$d3960680$c5991f41@wi.rr.com> Hey Jerry, Not a problem. I tell folks all the time, since I am getting older and my memory is not as good as it used to be, that being smart is not necessarily having all the answers stored in your head but knowing where to find the right answer. I always refer to references before making that final decision if I am the slightest unsure of an answer. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Mahurin" To: "krnet" Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 7:52 AM Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear > 'Scuse me folks..... > > I guess that my memory is going..... I have mounted two > sets of Diehl taildragger gear but only one tri gear; and > I did not recall any diffrences in the gear..... > > Thanx Mark for catching that..... > > I knew I shouldn't have talked so much....... > > Jerry Mahurin > Lugoff, SC > http://kr-builder.org > > On Tue, 7 May 2002 21:47:02 -0500 > "Mark Jones" wrote: > >Wrong, the sets are different for tail dragger and > >tri-gear arrangements. I > >have the Diehl Plans in my hands and here is a paragraph > >from his plans: > > > >The gear legs are shipped precut and chamfered. The > >taildragger conversion > >mounts the main gear on the forward side of the main > >spar with castings > >bolted on just outside the fuselage sides. The gear legs > >angle forward. The > >tri-gear mounts the gear legs on the aft side of the main > >spar with the legs > >angling back. The tail dragger version of the gear leg > >has a straight > >leading edge from the top to the bottom.The tri-gear > >version has a crook on > >both sides of the leg. The arrow points forward. > > > >Mark Jones (N886MJ) > >Wales, WI USA > >E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > >Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > >http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Jerry @ charter.net" > >To: "krnet" > >Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 12:20 AM > >Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear > > > > > >> The main gear and castings and gear legs are the same > >>whether it is a tail > >> dragger or tri(cycle). The only difference is how you > >>arrange the parts > >and > >> which side of the spar that you mount it on; and which > >>side you put the > >soda > >> straw in for the brake lines.... The parts are all the > >>same..... (I > >> think.....) > >> > >> As virg sez.... Yer makin me talk too much..... > >> > >> Jerry Mahurin > >> Lugoff, SC > >> See our KR2 at http://kr-builder.org > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: > >> To: "krnet" > >> Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 5:33 PM > >> Subject: KR> Diehl gear > >> > >> > >> > Some one was asking if the Diehl gear was the same for > >>taildragger and > >> nose > >> > gear. I got the off the Diehl website. > >> > > >> > The Gear legs are shipped precut and the edges are > >>chamferred. The > >> > taildragger conversion mounts the main gear on the > >>forward side of the > >> main > >> > spar with castings bolted on just outside the fuselage > >>sides. The gear > >> legs > >> > angle forward. The tri-gear mounts the gear legs on > >>the aft side of the > >> main > >> > spar with the legs angling back.>>> The tail dragger > >>version of the gear > >> leg > >> > has a straight leading edge from top to bottom. The > >>tri-gear version has > >a > >> > crook on both sides of the leg. << >>forward. > >> > > >> > Rgds., Bob Roe > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , > >>NOT "reply all" > >> > > >> > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >> > For additional commands, e-mail: > >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >> > > >> > See the KRNet archives at > >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > >> > > >> > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT > >>"reply all" > >> > >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: > >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >> > >> See the KRNet archives at > >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > >> > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 07:10:00 -0700 To: "Mark Jones" , "Jerry Mahurin" , "krnet" From: "Charles Buddy Midkiff" Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear Message-ID: <008d01c1f69a$0b4a4de0$a7b1fa43@vzcmidkiff> ------=_NextPart_000_008A_01C1F65F.5DF8D880 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Diehl's web site, he now has detailed instructions for the = installation of his gear including pictures and also downloadable pdf = files. http://www.diehlaero.com/=20 Bud=20 Lynnwood, WA ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Jones=20 To: Jerry Mahurin ; krnet=20 Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 6:11 AM Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear Hey Jerry, Not a problem. I tell folks all the time, since I am getting older and = my memory is not as good as it used to be, that being smart is not = necessarily having all the answers stored in your head but knowing where to find = the right answer. I always refer to references before making that final = decision if I am the slightest unsure of an answer. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Mahurin" To: "krnet" Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 7:52 AM Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear > 'Scuse me folks..... > > I guess that my memory is going..... I have mounted two > sets of Diehl taildragger gear but only one tri gear; and > I did not recall any diffrences in the gear..... > > Thanx Mark for catching that..... > > I knew I shouldn't have talked so much....... > > Jerry Mahurin > Lugoff, SC > http://kr-builder.org > > On Tue, 7 May 2002 21:47:02 -0500 > "Mark Jones" wrote: > >Wrong, the sets are different for tail dragger and > >tri-gear arrangements. I > >have the Diehl Plans in my hands and here is a paragraph > >from his plans: > > > >The gear legs are shipped precut and chamfered. The > >taildragger conversion > >mounts the main gear on the forward side of the main > >spar with castings > >bolted on just outside the fuselage sides. The gear legs > >angle forward. The > >tri-gear mounts the gear legs on the aft side of the main > >spar with the legs > >angling back. The tail dragger version of the gear leg > >has a straight > >leading edge from the top to the bottom.The tri-gear > >version has a crook on > >both sides of the leg. The arrow points forward. > > > >Mark Jones (N886MJ) > >Wales, WI USA > >E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > >Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > >http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Jerry @ charter.net" > >To: "krnet" > >Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 12:20 AM > >Subject: Re: KR> Diehl gear > > > > > >> The main gear and castings and gear legs are the same > >>whether it is a tail > >> dragger or tri(cycle). The only difference is how you > >>arrange the parts > >and > >> which side of the spar that you mount it on; and which > >>side you put the > >soda > >> straw in for the brake lines.... The parts are all the > >>same..... (I > >> think.....) > >> > >> As virg sez.... Yer makin me talk too much..... > >> > >> Jerry Mahurin > >> Lugoff, SC > >> See our KR2 at http://kr-builder.org > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: > >> To: "krnet" > >> Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 5:33 PM > >> Subject: KR> Diehl gear > >> > >> > >> > Some one was asking if the Diehl gear was the same for > >>taildragger and > >> nose > >> > gear. I got the off the Diehl website. > >> > > >> > The Gear legs are shipped precut and the edges are > >>chamferred. The > >> > taildragger conversion mounts the main gear on the > >>forward side of the > >> main > >> > spar with castings bolted on just outside the fuselage > >>sides. The gear > >> legs > >> > angle forward. The tri-gear mounts the gear legs on > >>the aft side of the > >> main > >> > spar with the legs angling back.>>> The tail dragger > >>version of the gear > >> leg > >> > has a straight leading edge from top to bottom. The > >>tri-gear version has > >a > >> > crook on both sides of the leg. << >>forward. > >> > > >> > Rgds., Bob Roe > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > = >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , > >>NOT "reply all" > >> > > >> > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >> > For additional commands, e-mail: > >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >> > > >> > See the KRNet archives at > >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > >> > > >> > >> > >> = --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT > >>"reply all" > >> > >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > >>krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: > >>krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >> > >> See the KRNet archives at > >>http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > >> > > > > > = --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org=20 For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/=20 ------=_NextPart_000_008A_01C1F65F.5DF8D880-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 15:15:19 -0300 To: "Mr. Bryce Guenther" , "larry flesner" , From: "Jim Sellars" Subject: Re: KR> flutter / Bingalis books Message-ID: <008201c1f6bc$5202e310$0100a8c0@LAPTOP> Fellows: As to balancing, I have enjoyed the privilege of flying in a KR2 retract, at 170 knots. This plane has about 400 hours plus on it and of course hasn't fluttered ever. It has balanced aerilons but not on the tail. reading what is offered in the books it seems that putting external end of the control surface, booms for airodynamic balancing would add drag and lower cruise speed, But in the interest of safety I would be interested in the collective wisdom as to what would be the best approach to balancing if you want to go fast and in thin air where flutter is more easily induced? Looking for more info. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mr. Bryce Guenther" To: "larry flesner" ; Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 1:41 PM Subject: RE: KR> flutter / Bingalis books > larry flesner wrote: > Erie feelings several years ago I was working a 15,000 acre ranch in N. CALIFORNIA outta Red Bluff. Tracking along the range I came across an elevator one half of it anyway. It made me wonder if the pilot made to the destination. My concious was certainly touched by the gravity of such a find. > > > > > >Netters, > > > >Several post on "control surface flutter" lately. I'll add my "opinion" > >to the mix. > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ > > Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 02:42:11 -0400 To: From: Subject: Fw: Fiberglass/instruments Message-ID: <001601c1f724$a644e1e0$a3851442@h1x1g0> ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C1F703.1EA559C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ----- Original Message -----=20 From: clappw@bellsouth.net=20 To: krnet@mailinglists.org=20 Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 1:02 AM Need best place to locate /buy/ foam,glass,epoxy,carbon fiber,peelply = and any other composite stuff for my KR - Boat stage complete - have = some foam but lack the rest and am looking to save money but not = quality. Also looking for discount instruments (good used) and = com/transponder with mode C/misc avionics that may be up for sale. Also = need Dragonfly canopy. =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C1F703.1EA559C0-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 14:21:06 -0500 To: , From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Fw: Fiberglass/instruments Message-ID: <005601c1f6c5$80718cc0$c5991f41@wi.rr.com> Wick's Aircraft Supply www.wicksaircraft.com Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 1:42 AM Subject: KR> Fw: Fiberglass/instruments ----- Original Message ----- From: clappw@bellsouth.net To: krnet@mailinglists.org Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 1:02 AM Need best place to locate /buy/ foam,glass,epoxy,carbon fiber,peelply and any other composite stuff for my KR - Boat stage complete - have some foam but lack the rest and am looking to save money but not quality. Also looking for discount instruments (good used) and com/transponder with mode C/misc avionics that may be up for sale. Also need Dragonfly canopy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 15:04:34 -0500 To: "KR Builders \(E-mail\)" From: "Larry A. Capps" Subject: Fiberglass/instruments Message-ID: <001b01c1f6cb$939a6e10$0600a8c0@schpankme> Below is a great contact for most of your composite needs. Applied Vehicle Technology http://www.avtcomposites.com/resins.php3 5641 Massachusetts Avenue Indianapolis, IN 46218 Phone: (317) 546-6840 Fax: (317) 546-6846 Regards, Larry A. Capps Naperville, IL -----Original Message----- Need best place to locate /buy/ foam,glass,epoxy,carbon fiber,peelply and any other composite stuff for my KR ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 17:32:14 -0400 To: "KR Net" From: "Brian Woodhams" Subject: Test Message-ID: <001d01c1f6d7$d3773110$0100a8c0@BRIAN> ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C1F6B6.4AF6BED0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Test ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C1F6B6.4AF6BED0-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 May 2002 23:43:46 -0700 To: From: "Peter Johnson" Subject: Other Plywood Types Message-ID: <000601c1f6ec$23b58d20$78a5e2d1@peter> ------=_NextPart_000_005E_01C1F621.0849EA20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Further to what Harold Woods mentioned yesterday, another good find = (again, a Canadian 'Windsor Plywood' store, was 'Baltic Birch'. I'm sure = a good lumber yard in any country would carry it. :)=20 This product comes in 50" square sheets in 1/8", 1/4", 3/8", 1/2", and I = didn't bother to look at the thicker offerings. The 1/8" is 3-ply, the = 1/4" is 5 ply, the 3/8" is 9 ply etc. The faces are solid though do = show some 'edges' of knots. The core material is the same quality as = the face veneers. I did both a 3 hour boil test, and an approx. 12 month soak test and the = plywood showed no sign of delamination or wood disintigration. =20 Overall the Baltic Birch is less stiff than 'aircraft birch' ply, but it = is still a good enough qualtiy that as long as you determine it's = physical strengths it's probably an excellant, and CHEAP! alternative. My 80% Grumman F3F-2 is being built using Baltic Birch almost = exclusivelly. Hope this is of help to others. mailto:pjohnson@voyageur.ca ------=_NextPart_000_005E_01C1F621.0849EA20-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 18:02:03 -0400 To: "KR Net" From: "Brian Woodhams" Subject: looking at buying a KR2 Message-ID: <001501c1f6db$ff291e00$0100a8c0@BRIAN> ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C1F6BA.758672E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have found a KR2 that I am very interested in.I have a couple of = concerns about the plane.Now I want to be able to take another person up = in the plane.The Gross weight of a KR2 is 900 but the plane weights = 648lbs empty.It has a 14 gallon fuel tank.Now buy my calculations 14 = gallons of fuel is 70lbs.So that's leaves 182 lbs left just for me.Well = guess what I weight 220lbs.So that leaves me at 38lbs over the gross.So = I guess my question is What is the g loading the plane was designed = for.If it is 6 G's can I go over the gross and just fly with in a 4 g = limit.If not this is just a really wide single place plane.Any help = would be great. Thanks Brian Woodhams ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C1F6BA.758672E0-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 May 2002 19:08:59 -0400 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: "Dana Overall" Subject: Da Mountaintop:-) Message-ID: >Did Ken Rand go to all the fuss over these fittings? I think not, he just >made them with hand tools, did'nt he? > >KRRon Forgot to mention in my previous post, to polish those correctly deburred alum. edges, work to at least #600 grit and prime with NAPA 7020 self etching primer. Not to start another fight, but just because Ken Rand did something that does not make it the premier aero building technique. That was 30 plus years ago. He didn't carry this down from the mountaintop chiseled in stone. He also had 5+ degrees of incidence in the initial wing................. Robinson laughed out loud when Mark Langford asked him about the engineering that went into the design. The reply was "what engineering" if I remember correctly:-) (got ya into this, heh Mark:-) I'm not trying to start another net war so let's not go there. Just trying to interject some rational thinking here. Now where's that foxhole:-), Jerry, is that you in here with me?? Not trying to start anything so I won't respond to any "negitivity":-) Dana Overall Richmond, KY 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host http://rvflying.tripod.com _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 19:23:49 -0500 To: From: "David McKelvey" Subject: RE: KR> Belly board Message-ID: Correct me if I'm wrong but attaching it to the rear spar is better than going forward of the front spar. You want your drag behind the C G. Dave McKelvey Grapevine TX -----Original Message----- From: Kenneth L Wiltrout [mailto:klw1953@juno.com] Sent: Sunday, May 05, 2002 8:09 PM To: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: KR> Belly board Just wondering how much experience is out ther concerning belly boards. I need to slow mine down a bit more to feel comfortable getting into the shorter runways. Has anyone mounted one of these to the rear spar as opposed to the forward spar? Hooking one of these up to the forward spar is going to be a challange to say the least, especially with a center stick. Comments?-----------------Thanks ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org See the KRNet archives at http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 19:31:13 -0500 To: "KR Net Response" From: "Jim Faughn" Subject: Oshkosh Message-ID: About a week ago, Jennette Rand called. Since she knew I was going to fly to Oshkosh again this year asked if I would present a Forum at Oshkosh about the KR. Of course I agreed and have already been contacted by EAA about the presentation. It will be on July 24th at 4pm in Pavilion 10. As a description, I submitted the following this evening: "In 1972 the KR 1 was flown and introduced the KR series of aircraft. As an economical, simple to build aircraft with ordinary tools, the KR demonstrated the average pilot could build and fly an experimental aircraft. Soon came the KR 2 that evolved with pre-molded components and the stretched version - KR 2S. This presentation will address the history, building process and flying characteristics of Rand Robinson’s aircraft. Don’t miss this presentation by a person that built and will fly his KR to Oshkosh again this year." In addition, I understand there will be a KR dinner on Friday night at 7:00-? This will be a fun event and I have already talked to Marti Roberts who says he will fly in along with several of Tulsa crowd. Since this is the 30th Anniversary, it would be great to have a good showing. I will be putting together a powerpoint presentation with the history, building and flying aspects of the KR. I am interested in building and flying pictures at about 150-200 dpi that could be used in my powerpoint presentation. If you have some, please e-mail me directly but please try to stagger these over the next few weeks since my e-mail quota will fill up rapidly if everyone sends them tomorrow. I hope I can do justice to the KR at this presentation and look forward to seeing everyone there. By the way, I was up flying my KR a couple of days ago and we are back up at the 155-160 mph cruise. That's another story but it is nice to have it flying the way a KR should be flying again. Jim Faughn 4323D Laclede Ave. St. Louis, MO 63108 (314)652-7659 Mailto:jfaughn@mvp.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 20:34:39 -0500 To: From: "M&C" Subject: Boiling plywood Message-ID: <002401c1f6f9$b07dab40$43ae4ad1@matandcat> If you are testing the glue by boiling the plywood you are only going to get it to 212 degrees f. and that's at sea level on a standard day/standard pressure. Less than that at any alt. Why not just throw the plywood in the oven and get the temps up to 250-300 degrees f. I would think this would come closer to ramp temps on a hot day. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 16:40:43 +1000 To: "KRnet" From: "John and Janet Martindale" Subject: Pushrods Message-ID: <001201c1f724$96e5a400$e4de12d2@m1g0x7> ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C1F778.42E318C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Phil Where did you get those elevator push rod plans? I was not aware that RR = ever produced them. I used 1/2 inch tube from stick to reversing arm on = rear spar (about 2 feet) then from that arm to the elevator arm (about 6 = feet) used 3/4 tube with the fittings you described. The centre of this = tube is supported in a sliding fitting just in case of any flex. 1 1/8" = seems overkill in 4130 but you might go for it in aluminium. John and Janet Martindale 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA ph: 61 2 66584767 ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C1F778.42E318C0-- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 22:39:11 +1000 To: "KRnet" From: "John and Janet Martindale" Subject: pushrod drawings Message-ID: <001301c1f756$89a93360$e5de12d2@m1g0x7> ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C1F7AA.56A772C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Phil, Mark and folks Those drawings of a pushrod system posted to Mark's site were drawn up = by a friend of mine, Terry Ryan (hence the TR in the drawing number) who = is also my Sport Aircraft Association Australia (SAAA) tech counsellor. = There are much better drawings available which form part of a package = that was submitted by Terry to the Australian authorities (Civil = Aviation Authority CAA) for individual approval prior to our = "experimental" category being introduced. Terry's KR2 is still flying = and was one of the first to be built in Australia. His drawings are not = part of any approved RR plans. It would be the right thing to do to = talk to Terry prior to using his plans as there may be some "copyright" = imposed by the CAA. If people are interested, they can email me offline = and I'll pass on their requests to Terry. Let me repeat that the = drawings are not to do with RR and any use of them is at your own risk. See Ya. =20 John and Janet Martindale 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA ph: 61 2 66584767 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C1F7AA.56A772C0-- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 06:21:45 -0700 To: "KRnet" , "John and Janet Martindale" From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> pushrod drawings Message-Id: <200205090621.AA259326226@jrl-engineering.com> Good advice, the right thing to do. KRRon ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "John and Janet Martindale" Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 22:39:11 +1000 >Phil, Mark and folks > >Those drawings of a pushrod system posted to Mark's site were drawn up by a friend of mine, Terry Ryan (hence the TR in the drawing number) who is also my Sport Aircraft Association Australia (SAAA) tech counsellor. There are much better drawings available which form part of a package that was submitted by Terry to the Australian authorities (Civil Aviation Authority CAA) for individual approval prior to our "experimental" category being introduced. Terry's KR2 is still flying and was one of the first to be built in Australia. His drawings are not part of any approved RR plans. It would be the right thing to do to talk to Terry prior to using his plans as there may be some "copyright" imposed by the CAA. If people are interested, they can email me offline and I'll pass on their requests to Terry. Let me repeat that the drawings are not to do with RR and any use of them is at your own risk. > >See Ya. > > >John and Janet Martindale >29 Jane Circuit >TOORMINA NSW 2452 >AUSTRALIA > >ph: 61 2 66584767 > > ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************