From: To: Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 105, Issue 1 Date: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 12:03 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. can someone help me? 2. Re: can someone help me? (Dan Heath) 3. Re: Oshkosh (chris gardiner) 4. Camber (Peg and Mike Meyer) 5. Re: Camber (Brian Kraut) 6. parts sources (Brian Kraut) 7. Re: Camber (larry severson) 8. Re: Camber (Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff) 9. Re: Camber (John and Janet Martindale) 10. Re: KR Parts For Sale (David Hartz) 11. Plywood (Justin) 12. Re: Camber (larry severson) 13. Re: CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS (Stephen J Robinson) 14. Re: CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS (Mark Langford) 15. Re: CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS (Mark Langford) 16. Re: Camber (larry flesner) 17. Plywood (Larry A Capps) 18. Re: Camber (Kenneth L Wiltrout) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 18:21:43 EDT From: Bdazzcamro@aol.com To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KR>can someone help me? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 1 I am trying to get onto the digest and cant. Can someone help me? I would like to see what every one is talking about in the group. and yes I have subscribed David Swanson bdazzcamro@aol.com please email me directly ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:01:45 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: Subject: Re: KR>can someone help me? Message-ID: <3F1DC259.000001.03272@Computer> References: Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 2 http://www.escribe.com/aviation/krnet/=0D =0D This is the URL, but it does not answer right now. =0D =0D N64KR=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Red Oak - 2003=0D =0D See our KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Click on the pic=0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: KR builders and pilots=0D Date: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 6:22:27 PM=0D To: krnet@mylist.net=0D Subject: KR>can someone help me?=0D =0D I am trying to get onto the digest and cant. Can someone help me? I would= =0D like to see what every one is talking about in the group. and yes I have=0D subscribed=0D =0D David Swanson=0D bdazzcamro@aol.com=0D =0D =0D please email me directly=0D _______________________________________________=0D see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html=0D =2EFrom bo124rs@hotmail.com Tue Jul 22 17:03:31 2003 Received: from law10-f80.law10.hotmail.com ([64.4.15.80] helo=hotmail.com) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19f76R-0003Sd-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 17:03:31 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 17:03:29 -0700 Received: from 152.163.253.1 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 23 Jul 2003 00:03:28 GMT X-Originating-IP: [152.163.253.1] X-Originating-Email: [bo124rs@hotmail.com] From: "Dana Overall" To: krnet@mylist.net Bcc: Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:03:28 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jul 2003 00:03:29.0221 (UTC) FILETIME=[D8BB1750:01C350AD] Subject: KR>KR X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: I hope no one on this list was turned off by todays RV short conversation. I make it a point to speak highly of the KR and now the RV. Both have their places and both perform the function the builder wants with his final product. I had a ball building my KR and I'm having a ball building my RV. Scott asked a question about seat belt attach bolts and I, just for fun, posted a picture of the plans showing the bolt. Why, because it got brought up in the thread about plans, bolt and having all the stuff on hand. I am sure Scott had a reason to ask the bolt size and I am also sure Dan and Mark were not complaining about building their KRs The planes are different and yes, their are a lot of questions with the RV. Van's has a builder support line for an hour in the morning and an hour in the afternoon where you can call and get an answer to the most far fetched question you can come up with by a very knowledgeable person on the other end. I've spent the last two shop nights bending the longerons, ie. "start at pre bend 38 7/8 end at pre bend 68 5/16 or whatever the measurement is...you ever tried to bend a 191" piece of 3/4 x 3/4 angle? I'd rather wrestle a web mattress. One thing I do think every KR builder should do is call Van's or go to their website and get a copy of the catalog. Most everything you will need to compete your KR will be in this catalog, usually at a much cheaper price than elsewhere. They don't screw people. Sorry for the rambling, I just wanted all to know there was no ulterior motive in the pics I posted this morning. I usually try and show at least one pic that can be used by the KR builder. Last Fridays was the seat back adjustment angle and removing one eyelet from the center of a hinge for easy removal. Keep on building gang, that is the only way it will fly. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY RV-7 slider/fuselage Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments http://rvflying.tripod.com do not archive _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:21:35 -0400 From: chris gardiner To: KR builders and pilots Cc: Owen Macpherson Subject: Re: KR>Oshkosh Message-ID: <3F1DD50F.7080209@attcanada.ca> References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 3 Thanks, Dana. I 'm good at following . It's leading that gets tough ! We will also be camping in Camp Scholler ....somewhere. I received permission today from EAA to park in the Auto engine area ( if the mail cards arrive in time) . This should put a few KR's together at least. Cheers Chris Gardiner Dana Overall wrote: > >> From: chris gardiner >> >> Owen and I are still planning for a Sunday arrival . >Will try for >> the autoengine conversion area if possible . >> >> BTW: When is the beer and brats night , Dana ? > > > > We are all going to be at the Weds. KR forum so that is going to be > the spot where we leave from. Since Oshkosh is so large, it would be > difficult to carry grills, coolers and so on into the site so we are > going to leave the KR forum tent and go to my campsite in Camp > Scholler. Since I don't know exactly where that will be, we will just > play "follow the leader, follow the dumba$$, follow the wandering one" > whatever you want to call me. We'll grill out, drink a "soda" or two > and swap lies. > > > Dana Overall > 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host > Richmond, KY > RV-7 slider/fuselage > Finish kit ordered!! Buying Instruments > http://rvflying.tripod.com > do not archive > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:39:34 -0500 From: "Peg and Mike Meyer" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: KR>Camber Message-ID: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 4 So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, = putting in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting = holes and today I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between = the wheels isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off = mood measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear = brackets do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the = axle. As a matter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're = several degrees off (about 4 degrees). For those of you messing around = with gear geometry at this point in your life, you know that this is a = lot of degrees. I can't understand this - it never occurred to me to = check this prior to bolting them to the gear legs. In fairness to the = people at Diehl, I bought the assembly second-hand, but it obviously was = not damaged. And judging from what I see on the web, it sure looks like = a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a shim is really not going to work very well = - a quick computation with my CAD program indicates that a 4 degree = tapered shim behind the axle is about .210 thick. I'm just sick about = this mess. Anybody out there got any clever solutions short of ripping = my plane apart again?=20 Mike Meyer From DanRH@alltel.net Tue Jul 22 17:58:51 2003 Received: from mta02.alltel.net ([166.102.165.144] helo=mta02-srv.alltel.net) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19f7xz-0003u3-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 17:58:51 -0700 Received: from Computer ([151.213.94.185]) by mta02-srv.alltel.net with SMTP id <20030723005849.ILOG7705.mta02-srv.alltel.net@Computer>; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:58:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <3F1DDDCE.000003.03272@Computer> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:58:54 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) X-Mailer: IncrediMail 2001 (2001155.2001155) From: "Dan Heath" References: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> X-FID: FLAVOR00-NONE-0000-0000-000000000000 X-FVER: X-CNT: ; X-Priority: 3 To: Cc: "Dan Diehl" Subject: Re: KR>Camber Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: I would definitely ask Dan D. if he has seen this problem before. We did not have that problem, but I am concerned about the extreme amount of cam= ber that we do have.=0D =0D This is why I always recommend the Grove type of gear. These things cann= ot happen with that type of gear and the installation is simple. I have don= e both and both have their advantages.=0D =0D I am not saying this for you, because you are committed to the Diehl at t= his point. At least you only have to tear out the bottom to see what is wron= g.=20 If you have to remove one of them because they are not the same, be sure = to get the angle from Dan, for the correct one first. =0D =0D dan@diehlaero.com=0D =0D N64KR=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Red Oak - 2003=0D =0D See our KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Click on the pic=0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: KR builders and pilots=0D Date: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 8:37:14 PM=0D To: KR builders and pilots=0D Subject: KR>Camber=0D =0D So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, puttin= g in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting holes and to= day I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between the wheels isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off mood measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a matter of f= act it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees off (about 4 degrees). For those of you messing around with gear geometry at this poin= t in your life, you know that this is a lot of degrees. I can't understand this - it never occurred to me to check this prior to bolting them to the gear legs. In fairness to the people at Diehl, I bought the assembly second-hand, but it obviously was not damaged. And judging from what I se= e on the web, it sure looks like a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a shim is real= ly not going to work very well - a quick computation with my CAD program indicates that a 4 degree tapered shim behind the axle is about .210 thic= k. I'm just sick about this mess. Anybody out there got any clever solutions short of ripping my plane apart again?=0D =0D Mike Meyer _______________________________________________=0D see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html=0D =2EFrom jfaughn@mvp.net Tue Jul 22 18:21:14 2003 Received: from mo1.socket.net ([216.106.88.132]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19f8Je-00045l-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 18:21:14 -0700 Received: from mvp.net (virtualmail.socket.net [216.106.88.58]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07A7A23B84A for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:21:12 -0500 (CDT) Received: from marzi ([216.106.70.153]) by mvp.net ; Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:21:10 -0500 From: "Jim Faughn" To: "'KR builders and pilots'" Subject: RE: KR>Camber Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:26:50 -0500 Message-ID: <008e01c350b9$7e67a780$99466ad8@jfaughn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Don't rip it apart. I had a similar problem and I had shims machined to make my wheels straight. I simply used washers on each bolt until everything measured out correctly. All points were different size and they were different between each wheel. They were made of steel and they worked great. Sure was better than starting over!!! Jim Faughn N891JF -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On Behalf Of Peg and Mike Meyer Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 7:40 PM To: KR builders and pilots Subject: KR>Camber So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, putting in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting holes and today I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between the wheels isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off mood measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a matter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees off (about 4 degrees). For those of you messing around with gear geometry at this point in your life, you know that this is a lot of degrees. I can't understand this - it never occurred to me to check this prior to bolting them to the gear legs. In fairness to the people at Diehl, I bought the assembly second-hand, but it obviously was not damaged. And judging from what I see on the web, it sure looks like a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a shim is really not going to work very well - a quick computation with my CAD program indicates that a 4 degree tapered shim behind the axle is about .210 thick. I'm just sick about this mess. Anybody out there got any clever solutions short of ripping my plane apart again? Mike Meyer _______________________________________________ see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 23:47:07 -0400 From: Brian Kraut To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <3F1E053B.2000609@earthlink.net> References: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 5 You are supposed to put flox between the metal bracket and the gear leg=20 when you bolt it on. I don't see any reason why you couldn't get=20 whatever angle you need with washers and flox. use some bagging film or = Saran wrap so you can get it apart, remove the washers, and reflox it aga= in. I would give Dan a call first though. If you have never had the=20 pleasure to speak with him it is a good excuse to call him and pick his=20 brain on any other questions. He is extreemely helpfull and just a=20 great guy to talk to. Peg and Mike Meyer wrote: >So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, putti= ng in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting holes and= today I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between the wheels= isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off mood measuri= ng and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do no= t share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a mat= ter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees o= ff (about 4 degrees). For those of you messing around with gear geometry = at this point in your life, you know that this is a lot of degrees. I can= 't understand this - it never occurred to me to check this prior to bolti= ng them to the gear legs. In fairness to the people at Diehl, I bought th= e assembly second-hand, but it obviously was not damaged. And judging fro= m what I see on the web, it sure looks like a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a= shim is really not going to work very well - a quick computation with my= CAD program indicates that a 4 degree tapered shim behind the axle is ab= out .210 thick. I'm just sick about this mess. Anybody out there got any = clever solutions short of ripping my plane apart again?=20 > >Mike Meyer _______________________________________________ >see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 23:50:36 -0400 From: Brian Kraut To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KR>parts sources Message-ID: <3F1E060C.70402@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 6 I am taking an informal survey of where everyone is buying their materials from. I am working on an aircraft product and trying to get an idea on which suppliers are used most often. Please send me an email with the names of who you use at engalt@earthlink.net. Please do not just reply and take up a bunch of bandwith on the list. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 21:21:56 -0700 From: larry severson To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20030722210913.02e73a38@pop-server.socal.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 7 I have the same problem. I have found Dan very easy to talk to, but the simple fact is that most of the companies supplying for the homebuilt market do not produce installation manuals that are appropriate for the first time builder. "Simply put it together" doesn't cut it. When I wrote manuals years ago, I had them reviewed by house wives who were not interested in what I was doing. Until they could easily understand what I was saying, AND wanted to try it, the manual was not done. Dan makes a good product, as does Great Plains, but both would save a great deal of support time and irritated buyer reactions if they would provide manuals that prevented comments like Mike's. Such manuals are not that difficult, nor much longer than those supplied. Step by step instructions, along with diagrams or pictures, at each stage of construction would help. The KR2 would be a simple plane to build if anything was defined properly and worked as advertised. At 07:39 PM 7/22/2003 -0500, you wrote: >So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, putting >in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting holes and >today I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between the wheels >isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off mood measuring >and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do not >share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a matter >of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees off >(about 4 degrees). For those of you messing around with gear geometry at >this point in your life, you know that this is a lot of degrees. I can't >understand this - it never occurred to me to check this prior to bolting >them to the gear legs. In fairness to the people at Diehl, I bought the >assembly second-hand, but it obviously was not damaged. And judging from >what I see on the web, it sure looks like a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a >shim is really not going to work very well - a quick computation with my >CAD program indicates that a 4 degree tapered shim behind the axle is >about .210 thick. I'm just sick about this mess. Anybody out there got any >clever solutions short of ripping my plane apart again? > >Mike Meyer _______________________________________________ >see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 21:54:50 -0700 From: "Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <001b01c350d6$8c881da0$0d02a8c0@charlesmidkiff> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20030722210913.02e73a38@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 8 ----- Original Message ----- From: "larry severson" To: "KR builders and pilots" Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2003 9:21 PM Subject: Re: KR>Camber > I have the same problem. I have found Dan very easy to talk to, but the > simple fact is that most of the companies supplying for the homebuilt > market do not produce installation manuals that are appropriate for the > first time builder. "Simply put it together" doesn't cut it. Dan Diehl has installation instructions and pictures on his web site plus a downloadable pdf version available there also. They can be found at the bottom of the page under landing gear. His url: http://www.diehlaero.com/landing.htm Bud Midkiff Lynnwood, WA ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 18:20:14 +1000 From: "John and Janet Martindale" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <006701c350f3$b90fc7c0$fb6ecacb@amipentium200> References: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 9 Mike I found with my Diehl setup that the toe in caused the camber to vary as = the aircraft was wheeled around backwards on the hanger floor, that is, the wheels were being forced gently outwards leading to different angles on t= he legs and giving the impression that camber was at fault. Have you checked that leg geometry is at least symetrical when the weight is off the gear = as a first step? If so, check each of the lower brackets for symmetry. If st= ill out by 4=B0 then it might be easiest just to make up one new bracket so t= hat both are the same. Only other thing could be a bent axle. John and Janet Martindale 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA ph: 61 2 6658 4767 email: johnjane@chc.net.au ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peg and Mike Meyer" To: "KR builders and pilots" Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 10:39 AM Subject: KR>Camber > So I just spent the last couple of months ripping out my retracts, putt= ing in a Diehl gear assembly, foaming and glassing the resulting holes and to= day I put my Matcos on only to find that the camber between the wheels isn't even remotely close. I sat there in a very pissed off mood measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a matter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees off (abo= ut 4 degrees). For those of you messing around with gear geometry at this po= int in your life, you know that this is a lot of degrees. I can't understand this - it never occurred to me to check this prior to bolting them to the gear legs. In fairness to the people at Diehl, I bought the assembly second-hand, but it obviously was not damaged. And judging from what I se= e on the web, it sure looks like a Diehl assembly. Moreover, a shim is real= ly not going to work very well - a quick computation with my CAD program indicates that a 4 degree tapered shim behind the axle is about .210 thic= k. I'm just sick about this mess. Anybody out there got any clever solutions short of ripping my plane apart again? > > Mike Meyer _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 02:44:38 -0700 (PDT) From: David Hartz To: larry.capps@comcast.net, KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>KR Parts For Sale Message-ID: <20030723094438.6102.qmail@web41304.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <000201c345ac$e297b370$0400a8c0@schpankme> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 10 LARRY DO YOU STILL HAVE PARTS FOR SALE? DAVE --- Larry A Capps wrote: > KR Parts For Sale - pictures available > > - HAPI 1835cc dual ignition engine w/ Starter (2 > hrs run time) $1,800 > > - Exhaust system $100 > > - Two props. (climb and cruise) $150 > > - Fixed Landing Gear w/ 500 tires and hydraulic > breaks $100 > > - Posa Carb. and spinner $75 > > - Stainless steel tail wheel assembly $50 > > TAKE ALL FOR $2,000 > > Regards, > > Larry A Capps > Naperville, IL > lacapps@attbi.com > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:36:17 -0500 From: "Justin" To: Subject: KR>Plywood Message-ID: <001d01c350b2$6e3c1d20$b5dc1818@computer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 11 I was looking over my Wicks book thinking about which plywood to order. = There is another wooden airplane in my hanger using basswood. I know it = is heavier by 2 lbs every 4X8. The options are mahagany $118 for 4X8(10lbs). Birch $82 for = 4X8(12lbs).basswood/basswood $73 for 4X8 (10lbs) Could someone explain these options and their strengths and weakness. Justin N116JW www.geocities.com/attngrabber14/Home ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 08:14:01 -0700 From: larry severson To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20030723081246.00bc4e90@pop-server.socal.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <001b01c350d6$8c881da0$0d02a8c0@charlesmidkiff> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20030722210913.02e73a38@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 12 I am not as smart. I see the directions and pictures and they leave me with big questions. >Dan Diehl has installation instructions and pictures on his web site plus a >downloadable pdf version available there also. They can be found at the >bottom of the page under landing gear. >Bud Midkiff >Lynnwood, WA Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 10:54:57 -0400 From: Stephen J Robinson To: krnet@mylist.net Cc: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS Message-ID: <20030723.111516.-376727.0.sjrobinson2@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 13 Mark, Been off-line for awhile because of a lightning strike which blew my modem, so catching up on all the back traffic. A couple of questions for you: 1. I priced out your version of the rod end bearing rudder and elevator hinges. I just couldn't justify it on my limited budget, so had to fall back to the original simple KR version. But it brought a question which you may choose to not answer: namely, do you have an idea of how many $$ you will have invested once your bird is finished? I have my $$ goal set at about $12,000-$15,000 over life of project build time. 2. I'm trying to incorporate all the good ideas you and all the others have been, and are continuing to offer up. Here are some of the modifications I've applied so far: A. Couldn't find locally 3/32" A/C plywood, had to settle for 1/16" or 1/8". Desided on adopting a goal of keeping the bird as light as possible and overall KISS atitude in details. So I'm using the 1/16" A/C plywood with the deck cloth fiberglass over it to compensate for reduced strength of the plywood. B. Lengthened the frame by adding 2" at each station to reduce the porpoising PIO that has been mentioned. C. I'm using the AS5048/6 airfoils for wings and tail feathers. D. I'll be using a Type (2/4?) VW engine with fuel injection. E. Having my tool and die maker brother not only help with rebuilding the engine but also designing the Betcham-design retracting landing gear. F. We are using 11" wheels so the wing roots will be flared forward as they approach the fuselage to accommodate these wheels in the retracted position. G. Using the Todd canopy. H. Will be installing wing tanks outside of fuselage, within the center wing stubs, plus a headere tank. I. The wings will be straight as I have laminated the center wing spars with appropriate dihedral from center point inside fuselage. J. Will be trying to keep empty weight under 500 pounds. That's about it for now. May be adding more mods as I go. Been keeping past KR-Net e-Mail catalog on all the other neat ideas which I will review as I come to those parts of the project. Steve Robinson Derfield, NH ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 10:32:49 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS Message-ID: <00c701c3512f$ac7271c0$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> References: <20030723.111516.-376727.0.sjrobinson2@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 14 > B. Lengthened the frame by adding 2" at each station to reduce the > porpoising PIO that has been mentioned. Stephen, This looks like a dream plane, but there's one little area of concern. If you also add 2" to each bay in FRONT of the main spar, you've added several inches. This would make it awfully nose heavy, especially with a heavy engine. A Corvair or other heavy engine needs to have the forward fuselage are to be built per plans without stretching. Any extra will probably lead to a CG problem . I doubt you meant that, just clarifying. I hope you don't have your heart set on 500 pounds... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 10:37:39 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>CONVERTING KR-2 TO WING TANKS Message-ID: <00da01c35130$595664a0$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> References: <20030723.111516.-376727.0.sjrobinson2@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 15 > But it brought a question which > you may choose to not answer: namely, do you have an idea of how many $$ > you will have invested once your bird is finished? I have my $$ goal set > at about $12,000-$15,000 over life of project build time. Oh, and I wouldn't be surprised if I end up with over $24,000 in mine, but then I've basically built it three times. I wouldn't be shocked if a KR could be built for $8000, given enough skill and scrounging ability, as long as you don't build every part three times like I've done... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 11:11:08 -0500 From: larry flesner To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20030723111108.00854180@pop.midwest.net> In-Reply-To: <007c01c350b2$e3b50d00$abc9fea9@o0c8u6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 16 measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear brackets do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the axle. As a matter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several degrees off (about 4 degrees). >Mike Meyer +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mike, It would sound as if one of your lower brackets is not right. If that is the case, I'm sure Dan will replace one or both. I would suggest that you level your KR side-to-side and measure the angle of each gear leg to insure they match. Then remove your lower brackets and lay them on a flat surface to see if they match. That should isolate the problem for you. I'm assuming here that your problem as stated is camber, the vertical alignment of the wheel and not castor, the toe-in, toe-out alignment. I made my own lower brackets for the Diehl gear to mount Cessna axles before Dan shipped the "new" Diehl lower brackets made of 4130 that replaced the early cast alum units. I used some Cessna type tapered shims from a C-150 that I salvaged out to give me the camber I wanted. These shims are availabe to adjust either castor or camber but are rather expensive to purchase (A.S&S) so you might check out other options. Ford at one time used tapered shims to adjust the front end on trucks with solid axles. I've not seen them but was told they come in 1/2 degree increments. That might be a good cheap option rather than trying to make them. Check with a local Ford dealer parts dept. I think you problem should be easily fixed as you have two spots available to shim, the lower mount to leg and the axle to lower mount. Take a deep breath, relax, and move on. :-) I can expand on how I made my brackets with basiclly a hack saw and welding done by a local welding shop if anyone is interested. I will be off net until late tomorrow (Thurs) night. I'm making a trip to fly a lady up state for a funeral and I'm spending the night with my brother-in-law and family. Weather is severe clear!! Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 11:58:46 -0500 From: "Larry A Capps" To: "'KR builders and pilots'" Subject: KR>Plywood Message-ID: <000e01c3513b$aea030c0$0400a8c0@schpankme> In-Reply-To: <001d01c350b2$6e3c1d20$b5dc1818@computer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 17 Mahogany plywood (5 ply), will provide sufficient strength at a higher cost (25-50%) over Birch. Birch plywood (5 ply), is 25% stronger and weighs 20-25% more than Mahogany. Mahogany vs. Birch is a fine example of spending a little more to save weight. By using Mahogany you can save 2 lbs. on the KR2-S fuselage sides. Regards, Larry A Capps KR Newsletter CD Naperville, IL -----Original Message----- I was thinking about which plywood to order. The options Mahogany $118 4X8 (10lbs). Birch $82 4X8 (12lbs). Could someone explain these options and their strengths and weakness. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 13:44:23 -0400 From: Kenneth L Wiltrout To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Camber Message-ID: <20030723.134424.2676.0.klw1953@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 18 I went through this 6 yrs ago myself and could not believe how far off I was, I also used Dan's landing gear package. I'm not sure exactly how the instructions read but when it came time to mount the lower brackets for the axles the instructions left alot to be desired, luckily I could fill in the holes w/a welder and redrill.. On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 11:11:08 -0500 larry flesner writes: > measuring and re-measuring again only to find that the lower gear > brackets > do not share the same angle formed between the gear leg and the > axle. As a > matter of fact, it turns out that between the two, they're several > degrees > off (about 4 degrees). > >Mike Meyer > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > Mike, > > It would sound as if one of your lower brackets is not right. If > that is the > case, I'm sure Dan will replace one or both. > > I would suggest that you level your KR side-to-side and measure the > angle of each gear leg to insure they match. Then remove your > lower > brackets and lay them on a flat surface to see if they match. That > should isolate the problem for you. I'm assuming here that your > problem as stated is camber, the vertical alignment of the wheel > and not castor, the toe-in, toe-out alignment. > > I made my own lower brackets for the Diehl gear to mount Cessna > axles before Dan shipped the "new" Diehl lower brackets made of > 4130 that replaced the early cast alum units. I used some Cessna > type tapered shims from a C-150 that I salvaged out to give me the > camber I wanted. These shims are availabe to adjust either castor > or > camber but are rather expensive to purchase (A.S&S) so you might > check out other options. > > Ford at one time used tapered shims to adjust the front end on > trucks > with solid axles. I've not seen them but was told they come in > 1/2 degree increments. That might be a good cheap option rather > than trying to make them. Check with a local Ford dealer parts > dept. > I think you problem should be easily fixed as you have two spots > available to shim, the lower mount to leg and the axle to lower > mount. > Take a deep breath, relax, and move on. :-) > > I can expand on how I made my brackets with basiclly a hack saw > welding done by a local welding shop if anyone is interested. > I will be off net until late tomorrow (Thurs) night. I'm making a > trip to fly a lady up state for a funeral and I'm spending the night > > with my brother-in-law and family. Weather is severe clear!! > > Larry Flesner > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 105, Issue 1 *************************************