From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net on behalf of krnet-request@mylist.net Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 12:00 PM To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 246, Issue 1 Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Dragonfly canopy (larry severson) 2. Re: Vortex Generators (Mark Youkey) 3. Windshield (Eduardo M. Iglesias) 4. LED (Patrick Driscoll) 5. Familiarization Flight Needed (Kenneth B. Jones) 6. Re: Windshield (Steve and Lori McGee) 7. Re: Colin's Lap Belt attachments (Martindale Family) 8. belts (Colin) 9. Aluminum Kit/WOOPS 10. RE: TurtleDeck Weight (Wood, Sidney M.) 11. RE: TurtleDeck Weight, etc. (Scott Cable) 12. Re: belts (Scott Cable) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 13:11:21 -0800 From: larry severson To: KRnet Subject: KR>Dragonfly canopy Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20031210130755.024a4420@pop-server.socal.rr.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 1 For those with Dragonfly canopies: If placed with the back just behind the seat, it prevents full access to the forward fuel tank. Did you cut it down? Cover the tank? Move it aft and shorten the turtledeck? Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 17:16:03 -0600 From: "Mark Youkey" To: "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>Vortex Generators Message-ID: <004001c3bf73$9506a210$6400a8c0@blah> References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 2 Alex, Thanks! Pictures speak a thousand words. Mark Y. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexander Birca (MD/RMD)" To: "'KRnet'" Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2003 1:32 AM Subject: RE: KR>Vortex Generators > Mark, > Try for example this link:http: > //home1.gte.net/pjbemail/VortexGen.html > If you want more type "vortex generator" in google and you will find > a lot of info. > > Alex Birca, > Moldova > > -----Original Message----- > From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On > Behalf Of Mark Youkey > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2003 1:27 AM > To: KRnet > Subject: KR>Vortex Generators > > > Rick, > > Perhaps you can explain the vortex generator to me. We have them on > the E-3, which is a modified Boeing 707. I don't see how they would help with bugs or rain, as they are on the top of the wing, 3/4 of the way back from the leading edge, and outboard of the elevators. > > I'm not sure what they do (besides generate a vortex), and I just > figured they are a "big plane" thing, and I shouldn't mess with them on a KR. But obviously they do something, otherwise they wouldn't be there. > > Thanks, > Mark Youkey > myoukey@cox.net > Oklahoma City > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Rick Wilson" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2003 5:13 PM > Subject: RE: KR>rain and the kr > > > > Alex, Vortex generators are generally not that > > effective except when used on canard airplanes. Rick Wilson. > > --- "Alexander Birca (MD/RMD)" > > wrote: > > > They are called Vortex generator, they are the > > > rain/bugs contamination fix. > > > I had asked before KR-netters opinion about to use > > > them on KR, but it seems > > > no body know about. Generally the Quickie and > > > Dragonfly owners who have installed them > > > reporting not only fixing bugs/rain contamination > > > fixing but as well lowering the stall speed. > > > > > > BR, > > > Alex Birca, > > > Moldova > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] > > > On Behalf Of Ross Youngblood > > > Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 10:51 PM > > > To: KRnet > > > Subject: Re: KR>rain and the kr > > > > > > > > > Good thing you don't live in Oregon. > > > > > > I've seen some paint damage on spam cans out here > > > due to flying in severe rain. I haven't flown my KR > > > out here, but haven't heard from local EAA ers not > > > to fly in the rain generally. > > > > > > Their was a canard aircraft which had some rain > > > issues > > > and I think I heard some similar comments from a > > > Long-EZ > > > pilot who had some canard fix. I'm open to hearing > > > from netters on this, but haven't been "warned" off > > > of flying when the wing gets wet. > > > > > > I think this is one of those "laminar flow" type > > > concerns > > > and at the moment, I don't even recall if the KR > > > airflow > > > RAF-46 (I think) was a laminar flow airfoil. It's > > > older > > > so I would bet it is not laminar flow... but I'm a > > > hose > > > head, and often wrong. > > > > > > -- Ross > > > > > > -> each time it drizzles i don't fly i cant find any > > > information on the > > > -> effects > > > > of lite rain other then higher stick pressers with > > > the Kr. it seams that > > > > most wood propped airplanes don't fly anyway do to > > > damage with or > > > > without > > > > urethane edge is what i understand. i just like > > > to know if IM caught in a shower > > > > will it do damage to the aircraft i always wipe it > > > down if it gets wet or > > > > washing i also avoid the hinge points (controls) > > > mac. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > n1055a flying > > > > flymaca711689@aol.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > see KRnet list details at > > > http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > > > > -- > > > ___________________________________________________ > > > Check out the latest SMS services @ http://www.operamail.com, > > > which allows you to send SMS through your mailbox. > > > > > > Powered by Outblaze > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > see KRnet list details at > > http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > > > > ===== > > Rick Wilson, Haleyville, Alabama KR2-0200A -99% rwdw2002@yahoo.com > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. > > http://photos.yahoo.com/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2003 12:34:58 -0300 From: "Eduardo M. Iglesias" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: KR>Windshield Message-ID: <000201c3bfec$582f7c80$d862fea9@portatil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 3 Hi -Second sending, without attach=E9- There is an old excellent article from Soaring (I send it for you) that explains how to make an excelent acrylic windshield in two steps: The first over a male mold of simple curve and the second in female mold = for the final compound curve. The temperatures of softening are specific for each type of plastic. = Some must be heat 100=B0 C during some minutes because they absorb humidity = and this it can cause globes in the surface. I have made some tests with small pieces and it is not easy, but neither impossible. Have luck and communicate like it leaves everything - Eduardo La Pampa Argentina Stan Hal I (This is a scanner copy an have many little errors.) =20 =20 One article in particular caught my attention because not only was it = fun to read but it reinforced an opinion 1 have long held Itat insofar = as he builder is concerned, a homebuilt sailplane is fundamentally a = collection of mixtakes that soinehow all get righted in the end. The = article was written by Bob Wailers, DUSTER builder and former editor of = the "Rag." As it must to all who build sailplanes, Bob and his partner. = AI Nelson. catise to the Time of the Canopy. But let Bob tell it: =20 Canopy Building and the Learning Process =20 This article tells how not to make a canopy. It is written that way to = discourage you from trying. People have asked me to let them in on the = secret of AI Nelson's and my success. We have developed many secrets, = but not much success. AI and 1 got together on this canopy project and = have spent several hundred frustrating hours and several hundred dollars = just.to get a nice canopy. Here is how you, too, can fail: =20 Start by deciding on the profile shape and make a canopy frame mockup = out of plywood right on the fuselage. Install at least' one false canopy = bow near the high point. Carefully shape the wood to define the shape = you want, which will depend on the amount of headroom you want, etc. = Now, fill in this mocked-up "plug" with urethane foam. Fitting the foam = is very, very diflicult. We used 4=ADinch thick, 2-ibs.lcu.ft. density = foam. There must be no gaps where the foam meets the wood. Don't try to = get by ~sing filler. The fit has to he perfect. Now, take your Sur-Form = tool and shape the foam to the desired contour. Here is where your = standard, Mark 1, ham=ADfisted hacker will screw up first. AI Nelson is = one of the two or three best known surfboard shapers in the world. He = has been shaping foam since the early 1950's and he says that the = shaping of the foam plug is next to impossible for.1he average guy. One = pass too many with the Sur-Foam or sandpaper and the plug is ruined. You = cannot. repeat, cannot repair a low spot with filler because the filler = sets,up harder than the foam around it and you can't trim it wi;hout = damaging the foam further. After the plug is shaped as perfectly as = possible. lay on several layers of glass cloth and resin. Now remove the = plug from the fuselage and add several inches to the edges to form a = skirt. Sand everything until you have approached optical perfection. No = hills, no valleys. Smooth. =20 JUNE 1975 =20 -. i .--- 1 . ~ 1-1-11 =20 Next, coat the*plug with pojyvinyl alcohol (PVA) mold release and lay up = a female mold over it. Use glass cloth followed with mat andlor woven = roving to get 311W or more thickness. Reinforce the edges with laminated = wood clamping strips and glass them on securely. Now pop the mold off = the plug and dress the inside with #600 wet-ordry sandpaper. Drill eight = or ten 1116" air vent holes in the high point of the mold. Get some = billiard felt * and soak it in hot water and stretch it over the phig = until it is dry. Then take it off the plug and glue it to the inside of = the mold. Seal the edges with tape. This felt costs about $9.00 per = yard. Get the cost picture so farTlf you use cheap felt you get terrible = mold mark-off . . . guess how we found out. =20 41 =20 Now, get every book your library has on acrylic forming and start = reading. We built two ovens out of scrap wood and asbestos paper. One is = tall and thin to hold the flat sheet verticalli, like the books say. The = other looks like a doghouse and is designed to hold the mold. Make a = paper pattern and cut a sheet of 111 Oth" thick acrylic to fit the mold. = Use a saber saw and a special abrasive blade or a fine=ADtoothed coping = saw. This stuff is inc~ooibiy expensive and cracks easily . . . guess = how we found out. =20 Hang the flat sheet inside the tall oven, using C-clamps and wooden = clamping blocks on the edge which will be trimmed off later. Weak = clamping here. or not enough clamps, will permit the sheet to sag as it = Sets hot. Wanna know how we found out? We found out in a basement filled = with flaming plexiglasal =20 Put a two-burner Coleman stove in the bottom of the oven and cover the = burners with metal deflectors to keep the fire off the plastic. Make the = oven so the gas tank is outside, and keep a wet rag on it. The only = thing we haven't done so far is blow up AI's basementl =20 Stick a probe-type candy thermometer in thue oven and heat the plexi to = "soft ball" (about 240*F). Now, remove the plexi. using cotton gloves, = quickly bend a simple curve in it, and put it into the inverted mold. = Clamp the edges to the mold, using many C-clamps and pressure strips = inside and out while the plastic is still hot. When it cools, unclamp it = and seal the edges to the mold with high=ADtemperature masking tape. (if = you use regular tape you will fail because the adhesive gives up at = about 250*F . . . guess how we found out.) A perfect scat between the = glass and the mold is mandatory. So tape carefully. The high-temperature = tape is expensive but is good up to about 350'F. Reapply the clamping = strips and clamps over the tape seal. Tum the mold over and support it = on blocks so that the two ends are at the same height to best trap the = beat inder it. Make some sort of plenum chamber over the air holes so = that you can attach your vacuum cleaner to it. We used an old funnel. = Now drop the doghouse oven over the mold. The air connector for the = vacuum cleaner should stick out the top. Cut a peep hole at each end and = slip the stove under the edge. Makesure your beat deflector works well = enough =20 31 =20 =20 =20 =20 - '171 =20 so that you don't burn the edges close to the stove . . . guess how we = found oul. =20 Heat the whole thing to about 250* and remove the oven to tighten the = clamps while the plastic is hot. This is a very important step. Now, set = up the oven again. Turn on the stove and heat the oven to about 320 F. = If you have trouble getting the temperature this high, throw a couple of = wool blankets over the oven. Keep pumping the gas tank and don't forget = to keep it cool. The plastic should sag at about 270'F, but don't worry. = Turn on your vacuum cleaner at 315-320*F and pull the plastic up to the = mold surface. You should need only partial vacuum. =20 If you haven't used enough C-clamps, at this point the edges of the = plastic will slip out from under them and ruin the canopy ... guess how = we found outl =20 When the plastic has stretched to fill.the mold, turn off the beat. = While holding partial vacuum, direct the vacuum exhaust into the oven to = cool it. The thick mold will retain a tot of heat. Now remove the rulnei = sheet of plastic and save it for laughs. Keep trying, though, and = continue ironing out the details. Eventually you'll get a good canopy. = Trim the canopy, mount it without cracking it-and y6u're all done. =20 This whole canopy-making operation sounds pretty easy [it does?-Ed.] but = in my own case it was by far the most difficult, expensive, and = frustrating part of building the sailplane. =20 In retrospect. after having spent all that time and money learning how = to mold plastic, 1 find myself haunted by the thought that it would have = been for naught had the con =20 tours of the plug not been #Imost optically perfect to begin with. If = you,re contemplating building a fancy canopY,Iikc this, give the = problern=AD--of making an essentially perfect Plug a great deal of = thought.-=AD =20 A fancy canopy won't do a thing for performance. It just looks pretty. = The construction method described here will work, but don't * expect it = to be easy. =20 1 would recommend that you stick to the stock Duster canopy (the one = shown !p the plans). However. 1 would also recommend that you hot-form = it, even if it d0C4 114YO only a single-plane curve. Make a plug with = a.simple curve out of sheet metal. Heat your plastic to about 24001P and = wrap it over your plug. You can use cheap felt for this lower = temperature if you wish. This will give you a stock canopy shape but = without the terrific stress buildup asociated with cold-forming. It will = cost only about $7.00 extra for the felt and asbestos paper, and you = should be able to build the canopy in a very short time.From matheson@dodo.com.au Wed Dec 10 17:59:45 2003 Received: from relay01.kbs.net.au ([203.220.32.149]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AUG7F-000759-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 17:59:45 -0800 Received: from [203.220.150.162] (helo=ralf) by relay01.kbs.net.au with smtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1AUFvq-0007LJ-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:47:58 +1100 Message-ID: <004501c3bf89$18c69c80$a296dccb@ralf> From: "Phillip Matheson" To: "KRnet" References: <121020030414.26155.36e3@comcast.net> <3FD6FD40.00000B.01444@Computer> Subject: Re: KR>Removing Adhesive Residue From Fiberglass And From Plywood Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:50:02 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KRnet List-Id: KRnet List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Any Auto Panel repairs shop should be able to help with the correct remover as well. Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au Australia 61 3 58833588 See our VW Engines and home built Parts and Kits at: http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 20:18:54 -0600 From: "Patrick Driscoll" To: "KR Mailing list" Subject: KR>LED Message-ID: <000a01c3bf8d$209c1620$892cdacf@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 4 Hey Pat, Were those LED calculators some kind of an updated version of the = beads on a wire calculators we had way back when? Talking about your abs = had a whole different meaning back then Pat Driscoll patrick36@usfamily.net Saint Paul, MN ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 21:35:42 -0500 From: "Kenneth B. Jones" To: Subject: KR>Familiarization Flight Needed Message-ID: <026d01c3bf8f$790057c0$8d7ba8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 5 I recently purchased a certificated KR-2 which I am "rebuilding" = (condition inspection after being setting around and being hauled around = the U.S.A. for 8 years). I expect this to take about 3 months (give or = take 2 months). Prior to flying, I would like to get a ride in a KR-2 = or -2S. I am located at Hogan Field, aka Butler Regional (HAO), near = Cincinnati, OH. If you are willing to "fly for food" (and gas), please contact me. Also, thanks to the netters, Tate Gann and Dave Mullins for provide = drawing and manual info I previously requested. Thanks, Ken Jones 11713 Bedivere Court Sharonville, OH 45241-5914 Fax: 513-489-6606 Mobile: 513-604-3273 Email: kenbjones@cinci.rr.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 20:52:38 -0600 From: "Steve and Lori McGee" To: "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>Windshield Message-ID: <001701c3bf91$d659fa50$0202a8c0@lori8v5h2xi9m3> References: <000201c3bfec$582f7c80$d862fea9@portatil> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 6 Your right, a very good example on how not to do it. Steve McGee Endeavor Wi. USA Building a KR2S widened. lmcgee@maqs.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 13:08:46 +1100 From: "Martindale Family" To: "Ron Eason" , "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>Colin's Lap Belt attachments Message-ID: <018501c3bf92$b9d3c5e0$75a0fea9@johnjane> References: <20031210030230.81907.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com><007d01c3bf1d$05fe8930$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> <008101c3bf35$771ce4a0$6501a8c0@Administration> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7 So you can use your 1/4 to 3/16 sleeves that are very hard to find of course :-) Most important is to ensure that the loads on the bolts are well spread across the spar caps with large penny (or is that dimes over there)washers and that the caps are drilled in their centres. Like the WAF discussion it is probably the timber that is the weakest point not the bolts. Progressive failure (??) of the timber might even be desired to reduce instantaneous loads on your hips/shoulders, vis-a-vis progressive crumpling in car design but Bill Marcy's approach seems to ignore this aspect. The Martindale Family 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA phone: 61 2 66584767 email: johnjane@chc.net.au ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Eason" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 2:51 AM Subject: Re: KR>Colin's Lap Belt attachments > How do you scale a engineering sketch, and why would you put a 3/16" > bolt in > a 1/4" hole? snip.... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 22:26:14 -0500 From: "Colin" To: Subject: KR>belts Message-ID: <009901c3bf96$883a7d40$f2452141@Beverly> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 8 Well then I feel good. I have installed the shoulder belts with AN4 = bolts and heavier brackets (RCI racing brackets) then the plans call = for, and have tied the supports cleanly to BOTH the upper seat shoulder = belt framing, and the rear spar, with twice the thickness wood as called = out in the plans, belts at the same angle through the seat back, and = secured once again with AN4 bolts on racing brackets. Now on to wing wiring and the landing lights... Colin & Bev Rainey KR2(td) crainey1@cfl.rr.com http://kr-builder.org/Colin/index.html Sanford, Florida KR Gathering 2004-see ya in Mt VernonFrom Boeing757mech1@aol.com Wed Dec 10 23:39:58 2003 Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.101]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AULQT-000A0A-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:39:58 -0800 Received: from Boeing757mech1@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r1.1.) id g.1d8.1654555f (3858) for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 02:28:08 -0500 (EST) From: Boeing757mech1@aol.com Message-ID: <1d8.1654555f.2d097688@aol.com> Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 02:28:08 EST To: krnet@mylist.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 Subject: KR>(no subject) X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KRnet List-Id: KRnet List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Kr>Aluminim Kit ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 02:30:23 EST From: Boeing757mech1@aol.com To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Kr>Aluminum Kit/WOOPS Message-ID: <1c6.130149a6.2d09770f@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 9 Can any send me a list of what comes in the aluminum kit? Chris Theroux Gilbert, AZ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 08:29:50 -0500 From: "Wood, Sidney M." To: "KRnet" Subject: RE: KR>TurtleDeck Weight Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C3BFEA.DA6DC360" MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 10 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3BFEA.DA6DC360 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 U2NvdHQsDQpNeSBSUiB0dXJ0bGUgZGVjayB3ZWlnaHMgOC42IHBvdW5kcy4gIEkgcHVyY2hhc2Vk IGl0IGluIDE5ODYuICBJdCBoYXMgdHdvIG9yIHRocmVlIGxheWVycyBvZiBmaWJlciBnbGFzcyBj bG90aCAoaGFyZCB0byB0ZWxsIGhvdyBtYW55KSBhbmQgZ2VsbCBjb2F0LiAgVG90YWwgdGhpY2tu ZXNzIHZhcmllcyBmcm9tIDAuMDc0IHRvIDAuMDk1IGluY2hlcy4gIFRoZSBnZWxsIGNvYXQgcHJv YmFibHkgYWRkcyBhIGxvdCB0byB0aGUgb3ZlcmFsbCB3ZWlnaHQuICBCYWQgbmV3cy4gIEJ1dCwg dGhlIGdvb2QgbmV3cyBpcyB0aGUgVVYgcHJvdGVjdGlvbiBpcyBidWlsdCBpbnRvIHRoZSBnZWxs IGNvYXQgd2l0aG91dCBtZXRhbCBmaWxsZXIuICBNeSBWSEYgYW50ZW5uYSBoaWRpbmcgdW5kZXIg dGhlIHR1cnRsZSBkZWNrIHdpbGwgd29yayBqdXN0IGZpbmUgd2l0aG91dCB0aGUgU21vb3RoLVBy aW1lIG1ldGFsIHNoaWVsZGluZy4gIFNtb290aC1QcmltZSBnb2VzIG9uIGFsbCBteSB2aW55bCBl c3RlciBhbmQgb3RoZXIgZXBveHkgc3VyZmFjZXMuICBUaGUgcmVtb3ZhYmxlIGJ1bGtoZWFkIGF0 IHRoZSByZWFyIG9mIG15IGJhZ2dhZ2Ugc2hlbGYgYWRkcyBhIGxvdCBvZiBzdGlmZm5lc3MgdG8g dGhlIHR1cnRsZSBkZWNrIGFuZCBvdmVyYWxsIHRhaWwgc3RydWN0dXJlIG9uIG15IEtSLTIuICBU aGUgdHVydGxlIGRlY2sgaXMgZmFzdGVuZWQgdG8gdGhlIHdvb2RlbiBzdHJ1Y3R1cmUgd2l0aCBz cyBzY3Jld3MgYW5kIGFsdW1pbnVtIGFuZ2xlLiAgSXQgdGFrZXMgc2l4IG1pbnV0ZXMgdG8gcmVt b3ZlIHRoZSB0dXJ0bGUgZGVjayBhbmQgZ2V0IGF0IGV2ZXJ5dGhpbmcgaW4gdGhlIHRhaWwgc2Vj dGlvbi4NClNpZCBXb29kIEtSLTIgTjYyNDINCk1lY2hhbmljc3ZpbGxlLCBNRCBzbXdvb2RAdGl0 YW4uY29tDQogDQoNCgktLS0tLSAgSSdtIHZlcnkgcGxlYXNlZCB3aXRoIHRoZSByZXN1bHRzLCBJ J2QgdmVudHVyZSBhDQoJZ3Vlc3MgdGhhdCBteSB0dXJ0bGVkZWNrIHdlaWdocyBsZXNzIHRoYW4g MiBwb3VuZHM/DQoJRG9lcyBhbnlvbmUgaGF2ZSBhIHdlaWdodCBvZiBhIFJhbmQgUm9iaW5zb24N CglUdXJ0bGVkZWNrIGFuZCBjb3VsZCB3ZWlnaCBpdCBmb3IgY29tcGFyaXNvbj8NCgk9PT09PQ0K CVNjb3R0IENhYmxlDQoJS1ItMlMgIyA3MzUNCglXcmlnaHQgQ2l0eSwgTU8NCglzMmNhYmxlMUB5 YWhvby5jb20NCgkNCglfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQoJRG8geW91 IFlhaG9vIT8NCglOZXcgWWFob28hIFBob3RvcyAtIGVhc2llciB1cGxvYWRpbmcgYW5kIHNoYXJp bmcuDQoJaHR0cDovL3Bob3Rvcy55YWhvby5jb20vDQoJDQoJX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCglzZWUgS1JuZXQgbGlzdCBkZXRhaWxzIGF0IGh0 dHA6Ly93d3cua3JuZXQub3JnL2luc3RydWN0aW9ucy5odG1sDQoJDQoNCg== ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3BFEA.DA6DC360 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef; name="winmail.dat" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IjQNAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgAB eJ8+BYAD AA4AAADTBwwACwAIAB0AMgAEAEwBASCAAwAOAAAA0wcMAAsACAAdADIABABMAQEJgAEAIQAAAEUy MUIxNzc5OUYyOTdENDVCMDE1RUE2QzQ3RkY2MUY5AEQHAQOQBgB4EAAAOAAAAB8AGgABAAAAEgAA AEkAUABNAC4ATgBvAHQAZQAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAAAfADcAAQAAADIAAABSAEUAOgAgAEsAUgA+AFQA dQByAHQAbABlAEQAZQBjAGsAIABXAGUAaQBnAGgAdAAAAAAAQAA5AGDDbdrqv8MBHwA9AAEAAAAK AAAAUgBFADoAIAAAAAAAAgFHAAEAAAAwAAAAYz1VUzthPSA7cD1UaXRhbjtsPUxFWC1YQ0gyLTAz MTIxMTEzMjk1MFotMjE1MDMAHwBJAAEAAAAqAAAASwBSAD4AVAB1AHIAdABsAGUARABlAGMAawAg AFcAZQBpAGcAaAB0AAAAAABAAE4AADyEdbC9wwEfAFoAAQAAABgAAABTAGMAbwB0AHQAIABDAGEA YgBsAGUAAAACAVsAAQAAADwAAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDdAQ9UAgAAAABTY290dCBDYWJsZQBT TVRQAHMyY2FibGUxQHlhaG9vLmNvbQACAVwAAQAAABgAAABTTVRQOlMyQ0FCTEUxQFlBSE9PLkNP TQAfAF0AAQAAABgAAABTAGMAbwB0AHQAIABDAGEAYgBsAGUAAAACAV4AAQAAADwAAAAAAAAAgSsf pL6jEBmdbgDdAQ9UAgAAAABTY290dCBDYWJsZQBTTVRQAHMyY2FibGUxQHlhaG9vLmNvbQACAV8A AQAAABgAAABTTVRQOlMyQ0FCTEUxQFlBSE9PLkNPTQAfAGYAAQAAAAoAAABTAE0AVABQAAAAAAAf AGcAAQAAACYAAABzADIAYwBhAGIAbABlADEAQAB5AGEAaABvAG8ALgBjAG8AbQAAAAAAHwBoAAEA AAAKAAAAUwBNAFQAUAAAAAAAHwBpAAEAAAAmAAAAcwAyAGMAYQBiAGwAZQAxAEAAeQBhAGgAbwBv AC4AYwBvAG0AAAAAAB8AcAABAAAAKgAAAEsAUgA+AFQAdQByAHQAbABlAEQAZQBjAGsAIABX AC4AYwBvAG0AAAAAAB8AcAABAAAAKgAAAEsAUgA+AGUA aQBnAGgAdAAAAAAAAgFxAAEAAAAbAAAAAcO9sIKzk92KZ/06TFuUBSyws03hzgCNjtEZAB8AdAAB AAAALgAAAEsAUgAgAGIAdQBpAGwAZABlAHIAcwAgAGEAbgBkACAAcABpAGwAbwB0AHMAAAAAAB8A GgwBAAAAIAAAAFcAbwBvAGQALAAgAFMAaQBkAG4AZQB5ACAATQAuAAAAHwAdDgEAAAAqAAAASwBS AD4AVAB1AHIAdABsAGUARABlAGMAawAgAFcAZQBpAGcAaAB0AAAAAAACAQkQAQAAAIwIAACICAAA MBkAAExaRnUVikAqAwAKAHJjcGcxMjWCMgNDaHRtbDEDMD8BAwH3CoACpAPjAgBjaMEKwHNldDAg BxMCgP8QAwBQBFYIVQeyEdUOUQMB3RDXMgYABsMR1TMERhDZbxLrEeMI7wn3OxjPDjA1OxHSDGBj AFALCQFkMzaTEWALpTQgEAIqXA6yvQGQZxTwCqMR4x3oNBTwADwhRE9DVFlQAEUgSFRNTCBQAFVC TElDICItIC8vVzNDIYBEVCJEIJQzLjIhgEVOnCI+Hu0ejyPBMTgf8G8goiMPJB8mkDMdgCVw TElDICItIC8vVzNDIYBEVCJEIJQzLjIhgEVOnCI+RXxB RCXNDvEm7ylvJPQ2QQ7wPE1FVEEHsEExLGA9IkcJ8ASQYXRFBbAiEtBPTlQi0FQTLPAF4UV4EPFu Z2U9BlJ2EzEvQQCQAiAgNhAuMC42HXA5LjEnIv4qzyUDNzcf8FRJKFRMRSXONA7wS1IgJmd0O1QI cHRsBGVEBZBrIFdladZnDrAkbjUf8C8zTzF/vyZFNJE3UChPJp87JDURYAA8Qk9EWSBkafRyPTtA cjqQOwMAIQMwOT2hZG8A4D2hCrFccf8YsD2hEPADMD4FEWA6uxzxETu/Zzk2H/BESVbPPdkAAEAX Otk2NENPQGL2UwWgAkAsOtkBwD3nCqL3PecKcSR8MCgRIeBDG0i4P0CfQa9Cv0PPRN9PW015cQfw UiB0NTM9UDWSd0s14gQgODAwIHAIYG4oZHMuOrs4HYAmbphic3ACgD34J2EBQHlLpyBJVAAIcBDx ETBkDCBpBUALgCAxOTj/MABUj1WfVqwFQDk8TRVX0ZFSkHdvIAWxdGgJ0TogC2B5L5FdwD5gZmna YhMxZwtgBBFjGGBeADwgKBEBWBAtcFKQZWyZAyBobwfgA4F5KVjv/1n/VqoAcFgQXA9NQi7gYNHf BaAtYFjfYp9WnFRG0AdA213xDeBrLTAEEXYKwAiQywQgA1IgMCAwNx2AYIH9a1E5NzALgBDwB5Bm n2evv2i9bHBkr2W8VAADYGIBoPJsUlBhZFRQZGBeUEbQ+2Bzb7FvL0EHQAMgU2Nmj6ttr1aN n2evv2i9bHBkr2W8VAADYGIBoPJsUlBhZFRQZGBeUEbQ+QnJg IC0wd2yfe3Vvdn51RvBv300zc0JnPm8EcHeTWCBdcW+xVVYzccJgsGN0L8J9YWJ1/wMQWEJz IC0wd2yfe3Vvdn51RvBv300zc0JnPm8EcHeTWCBdcW+FXE4 A/BeAAhgBUD/B4Bpsns/TUJfAGDQBJB378d4/1acUkFWSEZkYWCwvG5ucrBqAD1gLtAgVDF/EzFz QlKrgrFTUAWwNbBq/HVzBUBfAC0wgU9NM4B2zXNCUwRgX+EtUAUQB4D9gOVzagBgwIcSgw+EH1ac 34wbfMAHkS/Rc8JtUlCKD/VNQnYLgHkDIAeQYLAFwFdkcl/hEzFlVBB4UlBz/QhwZgDQbI+Oz26v b7EY0J8EYGqQAmAu8H7gbGtscP93cXGhc0IY0ArBkp9NQl7R85JhcgBnZztgLvCNQGDA/z5gcmle 0YmABpAC8GpScxX/UqqUo3OVAZADEZtfTUKJgH5yG4BSoXNhA6CSYTTALf4yli+XP5hPUpt9YZXQ lFH/LTBgZG+xXaAEcQOgovihr3+LFo0wBCAE8X0iZHIHQHXebQuArRBkYV9gZaQ/pU/bWv8BkGsH kQCQeGEwrTH/YLCfQ5ljh+Fvv3wWn+0u4OsFQHGhZS9BeWnxhzFYYe+Hw6FiETB+Uy5HH0gvST// Sk9LX0xvTX9Oj0+fUK9GKL+HADXAfNKj8gewMEEyt7//uM+537rvu/+9D74fvy/AP9/BT1G4 Sk9LX0xvTX9Oj0+fUK9GKL+BZAu sQ3gc5PggsHtexBNIhCt7jwskAqjXhEOZizwAMB/AW86c229qWJAfmABkLeQBaBtIvFvzglfAI1x OtJmjYKJgHvKSCBhUiEgTkshUNJf/9NlF+AB8Y2AESA7QBgwAEF/mhA/+dbex//JAdq/yQ45+R/h L0E6kMQfxS/GP8dP/9xfyW/Kf8uPzJ/Nr+Mfrm//r3/nXd8/4E/hX+Jv43/kj4fllSEQIDBLUVVP LfAXPVaesZQQZS4xQVJHodYQLVJJRyCgOmtA/HB408oKohACPwU/oz9h/z//8h8fG1dB8u/l7+v/ 6A9Z21lsaRzSJHw0JVFG6y3RsVF69YAy09wL8fj51i0E8iR8Nf0RLwKC8F9/+V8CLwM/+P/qH+sv VwYn/2swtdJUADVgV+Orw7LPXNbfC678ARjQlaA7QHN7EA6Q71gQL0B/UKNSYSR8LBA88d5SPduJ wRtRCxdnGbCfMv9dUIDRknBSpFMaNWAXRJIA3zuAED8RTxJUVBQ/FB8VL/0WPESRsmFRL9Au8F1Q spGvcrB0BF7CcrBSZHJScfD/1WEv0BzPHd8WPDUkoEcZ338a7xJURsCaEA+BU3JYImb/XdHTkdGx fWAv0By/I48WLT49LdIq3yvvFjxGsyBDH5myLi8vPxY8w3JTICPHJm8nfxJFNzM1Md8y760WPFeR UCEiQ1gweXsf8zZPEjZNTzgPOR8WPAQQQmOZsjFAeWFhAG9/04I+fz+PFjxCn0OvFjxfX0ifSa5F n0avHu4gIDB11zvPPN8SRVlCEiEqz0u/lRYtTqxwIFCkIFBhAHtggJ4QLZUwV+BqwJSAdf8PIGZg hxMmMp2AaqGNvlHvP1L/C5/Rdg5w0fQNIHRwUDovL3BU0y5CBy//08/U39XmXC9dNtfv+OpgT/9d NQbf289Zz93oVy9YP1lP/2kvaj9H729PcF9KT2yfba/92XNlEB9PHxI2w3CfEDFg/wEAiYGpkKFS nhExYFovWz9FY8N3e3Aua3J3wS75iSBnL9VioxJ+cZYQDSL/Xa9ev1/Ne398jWHfYu+AX/+B nhExYFovWz9FY8N3e3Aua3J3wS75iSBnL9VioxJ+bmZv Zj9rn2hfcl9zb4i//wXviA/sj+2f7q/vv4g/ks9/9BiUC/eTlM/6H5kv+uw14wkBloBPRFmKXd4Q mz9N+6E33iH2UE1Mi7B9AZ/wHwA1EAEAAACAAAAAPABDAEQANAA2ADAANQAxADYAMgAxADgA mz9N+MwA2 AEEANAA5ADgAQQA3ADQARQBEAEUAQgAyAEQAMABGADgARAA4ADcAMAAzADEAOQAzAEEAQABsAGUA eAAtAHgAYwBoADIALgBzAGEAZQBnAC4AYQBkAC4AbABvAGMAYQBsAD4AAAAfAEcQAQAAAB4AAABt AGUAcwBzAGEAZwBlAC8AcgBmAGMAOAAyADIAAAAAAAsA8hABAAAAHwDzEAEAAABCAAAAUgBFACUA MwBBACAASwBSACUAMwBFAFQAdQByAHQAbABlAEQAZQBjAGsAIABXAGUAaQBnAGgAdAAuAEUATQBM AAAAAAALAPYQAAAAAEAABzBGvfi95r/DAUAACDCNmaTa6r/DAQMA3j/p/QAAAwDxPwkEAAAfAPg/ AQAAACgAAABXAG8AbwBkACwAIABTAGkAZABuAGUAeQAgAE0ALgAgAEoAcgAuAAAAAgH5PwEAAABO AAAAAAAAANynQMjAQhAatLkIACsv4YIBAAAAAAAAAC9PPVRJVEFOL09VPVNBRUdFWENIQURNSU4v Q049UkVDSVBJRU5UUy9DTj1TTVdPT0QAAAAfAPo/AQAAACoAAABTAHkAcwB0AGUAbQAgAEEAZABt AGkAbgBpAHMAdAByAGEAdABvAHIAAAAAAAIB+z8BAAAAHgAAAAAAAADcp0DIwEIQGrS5CAArL+GC AQAAAAAAAAAuAAAAAwD9P+QEAAADABlAAAAAAAMAGkAAAAAAAwAdQAAAAAADAB5AAAAAAB8A AQAAAAAAAAAuAAAAAwD9P+MEAB AAAADgAAAFMATQBXAE8ATwBEAAAAAAAfADFAAQAAAA4AAABTAE0AVwBPAE8ARAAAAAAAHwAyQAEA AAAmAAAAcwAyAGMAYQBiAGwAZQAxAEAAeQBhAGgAbwBvAC4AYwBvAG0AAAAAAB8AM0ABAAAAJgAA AHMAMgBjAGEAYgBsAGUAMQBAAHkAYQBoAG8AbwAuAGMAbwBtAAAAAAAfADhAAQAAAA4AAABTAE0A VwBPAE8ARAAAAAAAHwA5QAEAAAAEAAAALgAAAAsAKQAAAAAACwAjAAAAAAADAAYQubIQmAMABxAv BAAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAFNDT1RULE1ZUlJUVVJUTEVERUNLV0VJR0hT ODZQT1VORFNJUFVSQ0hBU0VESVRJTjE5ODZJVEhBU1RXT09SVEhSRUVMQVlFUlNPRkZJQkVSR0xB U1NDTE9USChIQVJEVE9URUwAAAAAAgF/AAEAAABAAAAAPENENDYwNTE2MjE4MzZBNDk4QTc0RURF QjJEMEY4RDg3MDMxOTNBQGxleC14Y2gyLnNhZWcuYWQubG9jYWw+AGTB ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3BFEA.DA6DC360-- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 08:22:22 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Cable To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR>TurtleDeck Weight, etc. Message-ID: <20031211162222.45267.qmail@web40803.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 11 Sid, A couple of things: Thanks for below, I weighed my turtledeck it weighs 4 lbs 10 oz. That's still without the "roll-hoop" for the canopy interface, and with out the 2 additional'1.5 inch BID plys needed for the piano hinge interfaces, and of course no primer or finish yet. My turtledeck was 2 plys of 8.5 oz BID and 1 ply of 3.5 oz deck cloth. .020 - .025 thick skin. The Hat Sections are 2 plys of 3 inch BID Tape. I'm cutting a picture CD to send to Dan Heath so he can update the website.... What should I use for mounting plates for the pants? Cessna C150? any particular model? --- "Wood, Sidney M." wrote: > Scott, > My RR turtle deck weighs 8.6 pounds. I purchased it > in 1986. It has two or three layers of fiber glass > cloth (hard to tell how many) and gell coat. Total > thickness varies from 0.074 to 0.095 inches. The > gell coat probably adds a lot to the overall weight. > Bad news. But, the good news is the UV protection > is built into the gell coat without metal filler. > My VHF antenna hiding under the turtle deck will > work just fine without the Smooth-Prime metal > shielding. Smooth-Prime goes on all my vinyl ester > and other epoxy surfaces. The removable bulkhead at > the rear of my baggage shelf adds a lot of stiffness > to the turtle deck and overall tail structure on my > KR-2. The turtle deck is fastened to the wooden > structure with ss screws and aluminum angle. It > takes six minutes to remove the turtle deck and get > at everything in the tail section. > Sid Wood KR-2 N6242 > Mechanicsville, MD smwood@titan.com > > > ----- I'm very pleased with the results, I'd > venture a > guess that my turtledeck weighs less than 2 pounds? > Does anyone have a weight of a Rand Robinson > Turtledeck and could weigh it for comparison? > ===== > Scott Cable > KR-2S # 735 > Wright City, MO > s2cable1@yahoo.com > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. > http://photos.yahoo.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/ms-tnef name=winmail.dat > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 08:35:34 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Cable To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR>belts Message-ID: <20031211163534.78109.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <009901c3bf96$883a7d40$f2452141@Beverly> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 12 Thank-you Colin, as I (we) was (were) concerned. sounds like you've thought this through. Wouldn't want lap belts becoming detached in flight, and you getting thrown against the canopy suddenly, and then getting knocked out or disoriented. I lost an aquantance in a C210 because he didn't tighten his lapbelt, encountered turbulence flying low over the desert, got knocked out and lost the airplane. He never knew what happened. --- Colin wrote: > Well then I feel good. I have installed the shoulder > belts with AN4 bolts and heavier brackets (RCI > racing brackets) then the plans call for, and have > tied the supports cleanly to BOTH the upper seat > shoulder belt framing, and the rear spar, with twice > the thickness wood as called out in the plans, belts > at the same angle through the seat back, and secured > once again with AN4 bolts on racing brackets. > Now on to wing wiring and the landing lights... > ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 246, Issue 1 *************************************