From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 268 Date: 7/12/2005 4:54:36 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Turtle deck advice (wilder_jeff Wilder) 2. RE: Turtle deck advice (Joachim Saupe) 3. Matco Brakes (wcrawfor@cmhc-schl.gc.ca) 4. Re: Matco Brakes (Orma) 5. Re: Turtle deck advice (Dean Cooper) 6. RE: Turtle deck advice (Clint Matthews) 7. Re: Matco Brakes (Jeff Scott) 8. RE: Turtle deck advice (wilder_jeff Wilder) 9. Re: Turtle deck advice (Mark Langford) 10. Re: The Stall (Al Friesen) 11. Whisper assembly service (DENE COLLETT (SA)) 12. sorry (DENE COLLETT (SA)) 13. Re: Turtle deck advice (wilder_jeff Wilder) 14. Matco for sale OPS! (Orma) 15. Re: Turtle deck advice (Dan Heath) 16. Re: The Stall (Dan Heath) 17. Re: The Stall (Dennis Mingear) 18. Re: Turtle deck advice (Matthew Elder) 19. Matt question on your glass panel (Ron Smith) 20. ground handling (larry flesner) 21. Re: The Stall (Al Friesen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 11 Jul 2005 23:47:01 -0600 From: "wilder_jeff Wilder" Subject: KR> Turtle deck advice To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed All, I've finished making the form for the turtle deck.. covered it in mylar and duct tape.. I'm ready to mix the resin and start the processes of laying up. I have a single layer of 6oz cloth... a layer of 6in 6oz tape down the spine and 4 6oz 6in tape layed across the spine as ribs. On top of the 6in tape, I have 2.5in carbon strips layed ontop of the 6in tape, and then another layer of 6oz cloth to cover it all. Before I start to lay up the cloth... does anyone see any problems with this?.. is the amount of cloth I am using going to be sufficient? I have a gallon of polyester resin. My last question is the polyester going to be enough to layup the cloth.... or should I go purchase a gallon or more of epoxy? -Jeff ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 01:25:25 -0500 From: "Joachim Saupe" Subject: RE: KR> Turtle deck advice To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <410-22005721262525187@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Jeff, I think you are in OVERKILL mode. The turtledeck is NOT structural!! Joachim > [Original Message] > From: wilder_jeff Wilder > To: > Date: 7/12/2005 12:47:01 AM > Subject: KR> Turtle deck advice > > All, > > I've finished making the form for the turtle deck.. covered it in > mylar and > duct tape.. I'm ready to mix the resin and start the processes of > laying up. > > I have a single layer of 6oz cloth... a layer of 6in 6oz tape down the spine > and 4 6oz 6in tape layed across the spine as ribs. On top of the 6in tape, I > have 2.5in carbon strips layed ontop of the 6in tape, and then another layer > of 6oz cloth to cover it all. > > Before I start to lay up the cloth... does anyone see any problems > with > this?.. is the amount of cloth I am using going to be sufficient? > > I have a gallon of polyester resin. My last question is the polyester going > to be enough to layup the cloth.... or should I go purchase a gallon > or more > of epoxy? > > -Jeff > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 08:15:23 -0400 From: wcrawfor@cmhc-schl.gc.ca Subject: KR> Matco Brakes To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Thanks Orma, for the comparison, I have had Matco brakes for the past nine years, 450 hours on the plane and only want to change the pads. I notice the right pad gets more wear as that is the brake I apply the most while taxing and yes while starting and maintaining the roll on take off as well. I have to apply lots of right rudder during take-off or I'll be doing donuts. my KR2-S is a tri-gear with an 85 continental ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 08:55:13 -0400 From: "Orma" Subject: Re: KR> Matco Brakes To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001c01c586e0$f2a8c430$0202a8c0@ROBBINS1> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Mark L said that he is using rudder trim to take out some of the need to use the rudder during takeoff. I plan to try that also. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR Tweety, old enough to drink this year Flying and more flying, to the gathering or bust http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:05:36 -0400 From: "Dean Cooper" Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <008b01c586e2$655a8850$6101a8c0@HOMEOFFICE> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Joachim wrote:" > I think you are in OVERKILL mode. The turtledeck is NOT structural!! If I understood Jeff right, he has 2 layers of cloth over the whole thing, then he's going to have support ribs and a spine made of 4 layers of cloth tape and a layer of carbon. I'm not sure I would call that overkill. You could probably eliminate 1-2 of the layers of cloth tape on the ribs and spine, but the rest sounds fine. Build what's comfortable to you, it's your butt in the seat. Also, make sure the ribs and spine are formed as 'hat' supports. I assume you built a 'male' mold for the turtle deck vs. a female mold. I would read about Scott Cable's turtle deck process before you start at: http://kr-builder.org/ScottCable/index.html Good luck. Dean Cooper Jacksonville, FL USA Email me at dean_cooper@bellsouth.net See Corvair powered KR Project at www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR2_Home.html ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 07:07:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Clint Matthews Subject: RE: KR> Turtle deck advice To: jsaupe6848@earthlink.net, KRnet Message-ID: <20050712140738.1619.qmail@web50010.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Actually, it is structural if you flip the plane over. The added strength could well save your life by acting as a rollover structure. Joachim Saupe wrote: Jeff, I think you are in OVERKILL mode. The turtledeck is NOT structural!! Joachim > [Original Message] > From: wilder_jeff Wilder > To: > Date: 7/12/2005 12:47:01 AM > Subject: KR> Turtle deck advice > > All, > > I've finished making the form for the turtle deck.. covered it in > mylar and > duct tape.. I'm ready to mix the resin and start the processes of > laying up. > > I have a single layer of 6oz cloth... a layer of 6in 6oz tape down the spine > and 4 6oz 6in tape layed across the spine as ribs. On top of the 6in tape, I > have 2.5in carbon strips layed ontop of the 6in tape, and then another layer > of 6oz cloth to cover it all. > > Before I start to lay up the cloth... does anyone see any problems > with > this?.. is the amount of cloth I am using going to be sufficient? > > I have a gallon of polyester resin. My last question is the polyester going > to be enough to layup the cloth.... or should I go purchase a gallon > or more > of epoxy? > > -Jeff > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 15:33:47 GMT From: "Jeff Scott" Subject: Re: KR> Matco Brakes To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20050712.083401.17465.53683@webmail10.lax.untd.com> Content-Type: text/plain Rudder and rudder trim are only effective with a little bit of airspeed. In calm air, I have to keep the tailwheel planted until I see 40 indicated, otherwise I'll need some right brake to keep the plane headed down the runway. With 10 kts of crosswind from the left, take offs include bumping the right brake to keep it on the runway. Among the other changes I'm making to the plane, it will be getting some additional rudder added on this summer. Jeff Scott -- "Orma" wrote: Mark L said that he is using rudder trim to take out some of the need to use the rudder during takeoff. I plan to try that also. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR Tweety, old enough to drink this year Flying and more flying, to the gathering or bust http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:35:46 -0600 From: "wilder_jeff Wilder" Subject: RE: KR> Turtle deck advice To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Yes this is a male mold... The plan is/was when the resin has set I will pull the piece of.. and create a foam " roll bar" at the highest point. I will use carbon fiber to give it structural strength.. in case of a roll over.. Does anyone have any idea how much resin I am going to need to lay this up? -Jeff >From: Clint Matthews >Reply-To: KRnet >To: jsaupe6848@earthlink.net, KRnet >Subject: RE: KR> Turtle deck advice >Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 07:07:38 -0700 (PDT) > >Actually, it is structural if you flip the plane over. The added >strength >could well save your life by acting as a rollover structure. > >Joachim Saupe wrote: Jeff, >I think you are in OVERKILL mode. The turtledeck is NOT structural!! >Joachim > > > > [Original Message] > > From: wilder_jeff Wilder > > To: > > Date: 7/12/2005 12:47:01 AM > > Subject: KR> Turtle deck advice > > > > All, > > > > I've finished making the form for the turtle deck.. covered it in > > mylar >and > > duct tape.. I'm ready to mix the resin and start the processes of > > laying >up. > > > > I have a single layer of 6oz cloth... a layer of 6in 6oz tape down > > the >spine > > and 4 6oz 6in tape layed across the spine as ribs. On top of the 6in >tape, I > > have 2.5in carbon strips layed ontop of the 6in tape, and then > > another >layer > > of 6oz cloth to cover it all. > > > > Before I start to lay up the cloth... does anyone see any problems > > with this?.. is the amount of cloth I am using going to be > > sufficient? > > > > I have a gallon of polyester resin. My last question is the > > polyester >going > > to be enough to layup the cloth.... or should I go purchase a gallon > > or >more > > of epoxy? > > > > -Jeff > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > > Search the KRnet Archives at > > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > >_______________________________________ >Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > >--------------------------------- >Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! >_______________________________________ >Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 10:49:33 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <00c201c586f9$4e27ff70$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Jeff Wilder wrote: > Does anyone have any idea how much resin I am going to need to lay > this > up? You won't need more than a gallon to do either the mold or the part, but might need more than one gallon to do them both. Be careful about buying vinylester that you don't plan to use. Shelf life is very short. I'd use epoxy for everything but fuel tanks, personally. Epoxy is a lot more predictable and controllable (thanks to the more equal mix ratios), especially when laying up something that big that will take half the day. I guess if you already have the stuff on hand, you're about to find out all about the qualities, but the problem is when you order a new batch, the curing properties will likely be different in the next batch, because it'll probably have been promoted a longer or shorter time ago than you batch you just used. Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford email to N56ML "at" hiwaay.net ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 11:57:00 -0800 From: "Al Friesen" Subject: Re: KR> The Stall To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <014501c5871b$de3996b0$8bf451cf@alk1e9f7i3pcg3> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Larry, You have the control for the KR right, Rudder control on its own is not correct. Al ----- Original Message ----- From: "larry flesner" To: "KRnet" Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 3:48 PM Subject: KR> The Stall > >>Thanks for the report, good reading, but please be >>very careful when using aileron during your stall >>tests. You don't want to seperate the airflow from a >>wingtip and initiate a soin, that would be exciting. >>Denny ... > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > My KR, which is built and rigged to plans except for the 24" stretch, > will not respond to raising a wing using rudder. However, the ailerons > are effective up to and through the stall. If I try to "rudder" a > wing up it causes the nose to pitch down from, I suspect, a partial > blanking out of the horz stab / elevator. If I stay off the rudder it > will keep the ball centered on its own. So, I just treat it like it > wants to be treated and we get along just fine. > > As always , your results may vary.......... > > Larry Flesner > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.13/47 - Release Date: 7/12/2005 > > ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 16:31:11 +0200 From: "DENE COLLETT (SA)" Subject: KR> Whisper assembly service To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000001c5871a$d450ed20$b2a6fea9@dene> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi Murray My name is Dene Collett. I was asked by Russell Phillips to give you a quote to assemble your Whisper kit for you to approximately structurally complete. That would be the two fuselage halves bonded together, the landing gear and bulkheads bonded, the fin spars bonded in as well as the right fin skin. The wing carry through spar bonded in place and the wings rigged properly. The firewall and strengthening laminations all bonded in as well as the stainless steel covering on the forward side. My price for the above is ZAR 22,000. For any queries I can be contacted at home on tel: 2741 3792394 or on cell +27845805003 . I look forward to hearing from you soon. Regards Dene Collett KR2S builder South Africa mailto: dene.collett@telkomsa.net ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 21:51:21 +0200 From: "DENE COLLETT (SA)" Subject: KR> sorry To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000801c5871b$153b4600$b2a6fea9@dene> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sorry guys, that last e-mail was not meant to be sent to the group but a private individual. Regards Dene Collett KR2S builder South Africa mailto: dene.collett@telkomsa.net ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 13:44:02 -0600 From: "wilder_jeff Wilder" Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed The mold that I built was made out of ply bent around formers.. so I will not have glass that up, its been covered in mylar and duct tape....So I really not able to create a "hat" I may be able to create some type of hat out of foam and glass it after I pull the piece off. I realize that I am going to have some trouble correcting the high's and lows in it after I am finished.. because of the tape I am using.. any suggestions on how I would get around it? -Jeff >From: "Mark Langford" >Reply-To: KRnet >To: "KRnet" >Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice >Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 10:49:33 -0500 > > Jeff Wilder wrote: > > > Does anyone have any idea how much resin I am going to need to lay > > this up? > >You won't need more than a gallon to do either the mold or the part, >but might need more than one gallon to do them both. Be careful about >buying vinylester that you don't plan to use. Shelf life is very >short. I'd use epoxy for everything but fuel tanks, personally. Epoxy >is a lot more predictable and controllable (thanks to the more equal >mix ratios), especially when laying up something that big that will take half the day. >I >guess if you already have the stuff on hand, you're about to find out all >about the qualities, but the problem is when you order a new batch, the >curing properties will likely be different in the next batch, because it'll >probably have been promoted a longer or shorter time ago than you batch you >just used. > >Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama >see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford email to >N56ML "at" hiwaay.net > > >_______________________________________ >Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 15:51:23 -0400 From: "Orma" Subject: KR> Matco for sale OPS! To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <004b01c5871b$184b9340$0202a8c0@ROBBINS1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sorry net The Matco wheel that the person has for sale are 6" wheels and not 5" wheels. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR Tweety, old enough to drink this year Flying and more flying, to the gathering or bust http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 17:37:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice To: Message-ID: <42D43811.000001.03600@DANHOMECOMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" That is what I would do and it should be quite easy. Cut a long triangle shaped piece out of foam and hot glue it to the inside and glass it. See you in Mt. Vernon - 2005 - KR Gathering See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for building has expired. Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC -------Original Message------- I may be able to create some type of hat out of foam and glass it after I pull the piece off. ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 17:39:36 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> The Stall To: Message-ID: <42D43898.000003.03600@DANHOMECOMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I believe that this is due to the washout designed into the standard KR wing You should check out the characteristics of other wings to know if this still applies. See you in Mt. Vernon - 2005 - KR Gathering See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for building has expired. Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC -------Original Message------- > However, the ailerons are effective up to and through the stall. ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 15:02:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Dennis Mingear Subject: Re: KR> The Stall To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050712220236.96800.qmail@web51410.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Since I started this thread I guess I should clarify what I meant to say and what was clarified so concisely by another member of the list. I've been properly and politely reminded that maintaining coodination while in slow flight is what's really important, As was pointed out earlier by Collin(?, hope I got your name right), using aileron is ok as long as it is used smoothly, minimally and with some caution. However, Rapid full deflection deployment of ailerons while flying near the stalling point of the wing can excite the airflow over a wingtip in unexpected and surprisiing ways. I fly gliders and ailerons would be used very carefully while flying near the giders stalling speed. I realize that a glider is not a KR and I've read enough of these e-mails over the years to know that sometimes a KR is not a KR, there are many variations on the basic theme. If you've followed me this far though I do have a question however; Is the rudder ever useful in keeping the wings level during slow flight in a KR? And if the answer is yes, If the rudder has lost its ability to keep the wings level, should that airspeed just above the loss of rudder be the minimum speed used during slowflight? Denny ... --- Al Friesen wrote: > Larry, > You have the control for the KR right, Rudder > control on its own is not > correct. Al > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "larry flesner" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 3:48 PM > Subject: KR> The Stall > > > > > >>Thanks for the report, good reading, but please be > >>very careful when using aileron during your stall > >>tests. You don't want to seperate the airflow from > a > >>wingtip and initiate a soin, that would be > exciting. > >>Denny ... > > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > My KR, which is built and rigged to plans except > for the 24" > > stretch, will not respond to raising a wing using > rudder. > > However, the ailerons are effective up to and > through the > > stall. If I try to "rudder" a wing up it causes > the nose to > > pitch down from, I suspect, a partial blanking out > of the > > horz stab / elevator. If I stay off the rudder it > will keep the > > ball centered on its own. So, I just treat it > like it wants to > > be treated and we get along just fine. > > > > As always , your results may vary.......... > > > > Larry Flesner > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > > Search the KRnet Archives at > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.13/47 - > Release Date: 7/12/2005 > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > "I can train a monkey to wave an American flag. That does not make the monkey patriotic." Scott Ritter __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 15:56:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Elder Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050712225622.55553.qmail@web30201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I've done something similar with my KR-1... I wouldn't put the reinforcement layers on until you pull the skin off, otherwise you will have the bumps to contend with upon finishing... Check out http://www.infinigral.com/melder/flying/KR1/fuse5.php at the bototm, and all of page 6 for details on my setup... I did the reinforcement rib later as it was just a tad mushy for me (4 layers of 5.8oz cloth). I used Epoxy, and the whole layup took about 4 hours to do (the plug took 20 or so!) Took about 1/3-1/2 gal I would say to do the whole thing. Hope this helps... Matt --- wilder_jeff Wilder wrote: > The mold that I built was made out of ply bent > around formers.. so I will > not have glass that up, its been covered in mylar > and duct tape....So I > really not able to create a "hat" I may be able to > create some type of hat > out of foam and glass it after I pull the piece off. > > I realize that I am going to have some trouble > correcting the high's and > lows in it after I am finished.. because of the tape > I am using.. any > suggestions on how I would get around it? > > -Jeff > > >From: "Mark Langford" > >Reply-To: KRnet > >To: "KRnet" > >Subject: Re: KR> Turtle deck advice > >Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 10:49:33 -0500 > > > > Jeff Wilder wrote: > > > > > Does anyone have any idea how much resin I am > going to need to lay this > > > up? > > > >You won't need more than a gallon to do either the > mold or the part, but > >might need more than one gallon to do them both. > Be careful about buying > >vinylester that you don't plan to use. Shelf life > is very short. I'd use > >epoxy for everything but fuel tanks, personally. > Epoxy is a lot more > >predictable and controllable (thanks to the more > equal mix ratios), > >especially when laying up something that big that > will take half the day. > >I > >guess if you already have the stuff on hand, you're > about to find out all > >about the qualities, but the problem is when you > order a new batch, the > >curing properties will likely be different in the > next batch, because it'll > >probably have been promoted a longer or shorter > time ago than you batch you > >just used. > > > >Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama > >see KR2S project N56ML at > http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > >email to N56ML "at" hiwaay.net > > > > > >_______________________________________ > >Search the KRnet Archives at > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > >please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------------------------- Matthew Elder Orangeburg, SC http://www.infinigral.com/melder My Airplane Project: http://www.infinigral.com/melder/flying/KR1/ ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 16:37:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Ron Smith Subject: KR> Matt question on your glass panel To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050712233709.51193.qmail@web81710.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I have been looking at your project with great interest. I noticed that you plan to have a glass panel. Do you plan on having one similar to the one by DYNON, www.dynonavionics.com Their Electronic Flight info system, seems very attractive, although the screen seems a bit small. I was thinking that a laptop computer would be nicer, and then I saw what you were planning. Do you plan to give anymore details? I enjoy your site and project very much, keep up the good work. See my project @ www.ronsmith.myphotoalbum.com Regards, Ron Smith, KR2SSXL cypress ca, mercedesmann@yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 18:50:31 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> ground handling To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20050712185031.0084fd90@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >Rudder and rudder trim are only effective with a little bit of >airspeed. In calm air, I have to keep the tailwheel planted until I see 40 indicated, otherwise I'll need some right brake to keep the plane headed down the runway. With 10 kts of crosswind from the left, take offs include bumping the right brake to keep it on the runway. >Jeff Scott ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ My KR has an 8 foot wide main gear and a 4 inch steerable, full swivel, tailwheel. The cables to the tailwheel include Maule tailwheel springs and the cables are pulled as tight as possible without causing the rudder cables to go slack. To date, with 154 hours of flight time, I have never had to use brake on takeoff or landing to maintain directional control. I never touch the brakes on takeoff and never use brakes on landing until the tail is on the ground. And that's in all wind conditions. It doesn't seem to matter if I try to lift the tail as soon as possible or later in the takeoff run. All it ever seems to need is slight rudder inputs. Last weekend, with a 7 to 10 mph gusty left crosswind, was the first time I've even used what seemed like a 3/4 right rudder jab for about one second to bring the nose back to center. My KR seems to respond instantly to any of the slightest rudder inputs I make and my biggest problem is trying not to over-control. I have all standard size tail surfaces with a 24 inch fuselage stretch. Soon after the first flight I glued some 1/2 inch "half round" trim strips to the top of my rudder peddles so I'm not dragging brake when I don't what it. I have to rock my feet forward over the top of the peddles to activate the brakes. It seems to work for me. My biggest delight is that I have to keep reminding myself that I'm flying a tailwheel. It handles that nicely. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 17:03:20 -0800 From: "Al Friesen" Subject: Re: KR> The Stall To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <01f501c58746$a9504e00$8bf451cf@alk1e9f7i3pcg3> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Denny, Rudder control in my KR2S is not a wing leveler, it can make the result worse. I have tried rudder at cruise and it will control SMALL deflections in the wings but not fore long. I use ailerones to keep the wings level, dah. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Mingear" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 2:02 PM Subject: Re: KR> The Stall > Since I started this thread I guess I should clarify > what I meant to say and what was clarified so > concisely by another member of the list. > > I've been properly and politely reminded that > maintaining coodination while in slow flight is what's > really important, As was pointed out earlier by > Collin(?, hope I got your name right), using aileron > is ok as long as it is used smoothly, minimally and > with some caution. However, Rapid full deflection > deployment of ailerons while flying near the stalling > point of the wing can excite the airflow over a > wingtip in unexpected and surprisiing ways. > > I fly gliders and ailerons would be used very > carefully while flying near the giders stalling > speed. I realize that a glider is not a KR and I've > read enough of these e-mails over the years to know > that sometimes a KR is not a KR, there are many > variations on the basic theme. > > If you've followed me this far though I do have a > question however; > > Is the rudder ever useful in keeping the wings level > during slow flight in a KR? > > And if the answer is yes, If the rudder has lost its > ability to keep the wings level, should that airspeed > just above the loss of rudder be the minimum speed > used during slowflight? > > Denny ... > > --- Al Friesen wrote: > >> Larry, >> You have the control for the KR right, Rudder >> control on its own is not >> correct. Al >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "larry flesner" >> To: "KRnet" >> Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 3:48 PM >> Subject: KR> The Stall >> >> >> > >> >>Thanks for the report, good reading, but please be >> >>very careful when using aileron during your stall >> >>tests. You don't want to seperate the airflow from >> a >> >>wingtip and initiate a soin, that would be >> exciting. >> >>Denny ... >> > >> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >> > >> > My KR, which is built and rigged to plans except >> for the 24" >> > stretch, will not respond to raising a wing using >> rudder. >> > However, the ailerons are effective up to and >> through the >> > stall. If I try to "rudder" a wing up it causes >> the nose to >> > pitch down from, I suspect, a partial blanking out >> of the >> > horz stab / elevator. If I stay off the rudder it >> will keep the >> > ball centered on its own. So, I just treat it >> like it wants to >> > be treated and we get along just fine. >> > >> > As always , your results may vary.......... >> > >> > Larry Flesner >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________ >> > Search the KRnet Archives at >> http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to >> KRnet-leave@mylist.net >> > please see other KRnet info at >> http://www.krnet.org/info.html >> > >> > >> > -- >> > No virus found in this incoming message. >> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.13/47 - >> Release Date: 7/12/2005 >> > >> > >> >> >> _______________________________________ >> Search the KRnet Archives at >> http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >> please see other KRnet info at >> http://www.krnet.org/info.html >> > > > "I can train a monkey to wave an American flag. That does not make the > monkey patriotic." > > Scott Ritter > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.13/47 - Release Date: 7/12/2005 > > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 268 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================