From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 80 Date: 2/22/2005 4:25:26 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Alum Angle (Matthew Elder) 2. Re: Timber top deck (raybeth123@sbcglobal.net) 3. Re: Alum Angle (Ron Eason) 4. RE: Alum Angle (Jack Cooper) 5. Electronic Ignition (Robert L. Stone) 6. R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition (Serge VIDAL) 7. Fw: (patrusso) 8. Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition (Phil Matheson) 9. Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition (Robert L. Stone) 10. Re: Electronic Ignition (Jeff Scott) 11. Re: (Robert L. Stone) 12. KR2S T/D Wanted (Terry Teer) 13. Electronic Ignition (ronevogt@cox.net) 14. KR2S Wanted (Terry Teer) 15. Re: Electronic Ignition(Subaru Ignition) (Orma) 16. Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition (larry severson) 17. Subaru Ignition (ronevogt@cox.net) 18. What resin to use? (Born2Fly32570@wmconnect.com) 19. Re: Re: (patrusso) 20. Re: Subaru Ignition (Phil Payne) 21. Re: What resin to use? (Mark Jones) 22. Re: Re: (Dan Heath) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:33:43 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Elder Subject: KR> Alum Angle To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050222053344.63219.qmail@web30205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello all, Just wondering if anyone has a peice of 2024-T3 Alum Angle (1.5" x 1.5", or 1.25" x 1.25") that's 1/8" thick laying around... Oh about a foot or so should do. I need a small section to make a part, and it's the only peice I need (so i think). I don't feel like buying a 6 or 12ft minimum from AS&S/Wicks... when I only need a foot. Anyone have a scrap they want to give/sell me? Reply OFFLIST please... TIA, Matt ===== ------------------------------------------------- Matthew Elder Orangeburg, SC http://www.infinigral.com/melder My Airplane Project: http://kr1.infinigral.com ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 07:41:41 -0600 From: Subject: Re: KR> Timber top deck To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <002b01c518e4$3decb3e0$d1459445@DELL> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original I covered my inner wings and turtledeck with 1/16 inch thick plywood. I haven't flown yet and no problems this far. I did cover the plywood with one layer of KR (6oz. fiberglass) and one layer of deck(11/2 oz.) fiberglass. Ray Goree ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 07:32:56 -0800 From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> Alum Angle To: KRnet Message-ID: <200502220732.AA9568990@jrl-engineering.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Try this location it's where you can buy almost anything you need for airplane building. http://www.metalbythefoot.com KRron Ronald R. Eason Sr. Pres. & CEO, KCMO Office J.R.L. Engineering Consortium Ltd. 816-468-4091, Kansas City, MO. ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Matthew Elder Reply-To: KRnet Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:33:43 -0800 (PST) Hello all, Just wondering if anyone has a peice of 2024-T3 Alum Angle (1.5" x 1.5", or 1.25" x 1.25") that's 1/8" thick laying around... Oh about a foot or so should do. I need a small section to make a part, and it's the only peice I need (so i think). I don't feel like buying a 6 or 12ft minimum from AS&S/Wicks... when I only need a foot. Anyone have a scrap they want to give/sell me? Reply OFFLIST please... TIA, Matt ===== ------------------------------------------------- Matthew Elder Orangeburg, SC http://www.infinigral.com/melder My Airplane Project: http://kr1.infinigral.com _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ________________________________________________________________ Sent via the WebMail system at jrl-engineering.com ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:49:04 -0500 From: "Jack Cooper" Subject: RE: KR> Alum Angle To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <410-22005222216494953@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Wicks will usually cut the length you need. Call them and ask. Jack Cooper > [Original Message] > From: Matthew Elder > To: KRnet > Date: 2/22/2005 12:33:45 AM > Subject: KR> Alum Angle > > Hello all, > > Just wondering if anyone has a peice of 2024-T3 Alum > Angle (1.5" x 1.5", or 1.25" x 1.25") that's 1/8" > thick laying around... Oh about a foot or so should > do. > > I need a small section to make a part, and it's the > only peice I need (so i think). > > I don't feel like buying a 6 or 12ft minimum from AS&S/Wicks... when I > only need a foot. Anyone have a scrap they want to give/sell me? > > Reply OFFLIST please... > > TIA, > Matt > > > ===== > ------------------------------------------------- > Matthew Elder > Orangeburg, SC > http://www.infinigral.com/melder > > My Airplane Project: > http://kr1.infinigral.com > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:51:40 -0600 From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: KR> Electronic Ignition To: "KR Builders Pilots" Message-ID: <000501c51907$29db98d0$a624c944@yourat5qgaac3z> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Netters, I have heard that the modern electronic ignition system is more reliable than the conventional two magneto set-up in all aircraft engines. Assuming this is true, opinions from any of you who are knowledgeable in this area would be welcome. Also does anyone know where if at all an electronic ignition to use on a VW engine is available. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:39:06 +0100 From: "Serge VIDAL" Subject: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition To: KRnet Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Bob, This is one of my pet subjects, so allow me to give you my very biased opinion, and my personal solution. Magnetos date back to the stone age of the automotive industry. Being a geared system, they are, by essence, very unreliable. This is the very reason why there are two of them on an aircraft (Other engine components, like the carburetor, are not redundant, right?). Magnetos are a pain: they are very expensive, they fail a lot, have a short service life, are difficult to set, and have a very hazardous failure mode (remember the "P" lead story?) In the automotive industry, magnetos have long been replaced. First, in the 1930's, by distributors, which were much more reliable. Then, in the 1970's, by electronic ignition. Unfortunately, the aircraft industry, with its wonderful certification process, is much more conservative, and so, we can keep the magnetos alive, at great expenses; and our reward is that we can show off when visiting a car museum! ;-). The reason that is always mentioned in favour of magnetos is that magnetos produce their own ignition current, so the engine can still run in case of total electrical failure (master off, the engine still runs). Trouble is, dual magneto failures are much more frequent than total electrical failures, especially if the electrical system is well designed. I know of at least one company that solved the problem, and that's Jabiru of Australia. If I am not mistaken, they have an electronic ignition that creates its own current from the crankshaft rotation. We, as experimental builders, can go around that, and go for electronic ignition that is fed from the electrical system. But it is wise, in that case, to design your system so as to make sure that an electrical failure is highly unlikely. Basically, you can rely on the alternator or the battery, provided failure of the one is not going to cause failure of the other; also, you must make sure that failure of either source is immediately detected (through annunciators, or whatever). You must also make sure that in case of alternator failure, the battery gives you enough time to react before the engine dies. Electronic ignition is not only highly reliable; it is also very stable: no periodical setting whatsoever, and pinpoint timing accuracy. Now, my solution. On my 2.0 liter Type 4 VW, recently replaced by a 2.4 liter Type 4 VW, I run a fully dual redundant electronic ignition system. This consists of two solid state electronic ignitions, salvaged from 1980's motorcycles. These are nice, because: 1 - They have very few components; 2 - They were designed for a very hot, very vibrating environment; 3 - They run from the crankshaft, not the camshaft; no gears involved; 4 - The timing pick-up is magnetic; no mechanical contact, friction, etc. 5 - They are extremely light and compact 6 - They come straight from the junkyard, and cost almost nothing. If one of them fails, I get a warning through engine RPM drop. If my alternator fails, I am warned by an annunciator, plus the ammeter; If my battery fails, I am warned by an annunciator, plus the ammeter; I also have a couple of diodes protecting the electrical circuit . This setting has logged 400 hours on my KR2, without a single glitch. I have no starter, and it does not matter: the engine starts beautifully every time. More sophisticated systems exist, but I doubt if any electronic ignition system can be more reliable or cheaper than that. Now, let's dig quickly, before the magneto fan club attacks... Serge Vidal KR2 "Kilimanjaro Cloud" Paris, France "Robert L. Stone" Envoyé par : krnet-bounces@mylist.net 2005-02-22 18:51 Veuillez répondre à KRnet Remis le : 2005-02-22 18:53 Pour : "KR Builders Pilots" cc : (ccc : Serge VIDAL/DNSA/SAGEM) Objet : KR> Electronic Ignition Netters, I have heard that the modern electronic ignition system is more reliable than the conventional two magneto set-up in all aircraft engines. Assuming this is true, opinions from any of you who are knowledgeable in this area would be welcome. Also does anyone know where if at all an electronic ignition to use on a VW engine is available. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:41:08 -0500 From: "patrusso" Subject: KR> Fw: To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001c01c5191e$d6f60d90$2fa572d8@patrusso> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Robert Stone Here is a e mail I got on the subject from one of our KR colleagues a few weeks ago. I am running single ignition and feel that the following info has merit....the choice is still obviously mine...I am sticking with my Great Plains electronics but would certainly consider two different ignitions if I had the choice. ----- Original Message ----- From: Orma To: patrusso Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 3:41 PM Subject: Re: Hello Pat Mt Vernon, Ill is just north of St Louis. To register, Go to the KRnet home page and click on the link to the 2005 gathering web site. As for the electronic vs. the magneto, mags are old technology and if yours is new or in good condition, it should work well. The electronic from GPASC should also work well, however some of the electronic ignitions are internally set for the maximum spark advance and will not start the engine. The mag if it has an impulse coupler will start and then move to the advanced position. I have on rare occasions seen a mag have problems. They usually start performing poorly just like all point type ignition systems. They generally never fail without warning first. That is not true with the electronic, when they fail it is usually without warning. I have used the Bosch 009 as a single ignition for a lot of years. I currently have a Slick and the 009. Hope this helps. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR celebrating 20 years Flying, flying and more flying http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:50:10 +1100 From: "Phil Matheson" Subject: Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <006601c51920$1a392e10$9eb1dccb@Office> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Serge. Hi mate, hope all is well. Any chance of heaps more info on your Elect Ign system? Photo's. drawing ??? People keep telling me it's too hard adn too expensive and too much trouble. Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au VH-PKR ( Phil's KR) 61 3 58833588 Australia.( Down Under) See My KR2 Building Web Page at: http://mywebpage.netscape.com/flyingkrphil/VHPKR.html See our VW Engines and Home built web page at http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:59:34 -0600 From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000f01c51921$6a0a1cf0$a624c944@yourat5qgaac3z> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Serge, With all of your obvious knowledge and know how, I wish you lived in Harker Heights, Texas, USA instead of Paris, France. What I really need is a prefabricated system that comes with instructions for armatures as to how to install it. I am competent in electrical systems in homes but not so knowledgeable when it comes to vehicles. Anyway thanks for your response. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serge VIDAL" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 12:39 PM Subject: Réf. : KR> Electronic Ignition Bob, This is one of my pet subjects, so allow me to give you my very biased opinion, and my personal solution. Magnetos date back to the stone age of the automotive industry. Being a geared system, they are, by essence, very unreliable. This is the very reason why there are two of them on an aircraft (Other engine components, like the carburetor, are not redundant, right?). Magnetos are a pain: they are very expensive, they fail a lot, have a short service life, are difficult to set, and have a very hazardous failure mode (remember the "P" lead story?) In the automotive industry, magnetos have long been replaced. First, in the 1930's, by distributors, which were much more reliable. Then, in the 1970's, by electronic ignition. Unfortunately, the aircraft industry, with its wonderful certification process, is much more conservative, and so, we can keep the magnetos alive, at great expenses; and our reward is that we can show off when visiting a car museum! ;-). The reason that is always mentioned in favour of magnetos is that magnetos produce their own ignition current, so the engine can still run in case of total electrical failure (master off, the engine still runs). Trouble is, dual magneto failures are much more frequent than total electrical failures, especially if the electrical system is well designed. I know of at least one company that solved the problem, and that's Jabiru of Australia. If I am not mistaken, they have an electronic ignition that creates its own current from the crankshaft rotation. We, as experimental builders, can go around that, and go for electronic ignition that is fed from the electrical system. But it is wise, in that case, to design your system so as to make sure that an electrical failure is highly unlikely. Basically, you can rely on the alternator or the battery, provided failure of the one is not going to cause failure of the other; also, you must make sure that failure of either source is immediately detected (through annunciators, or whatever). You must also make sure that in case of alternator failure, the battery gives you enough time to react before the engine dies. Electronic ignition is not only highly reliable; it is also very stable: no periodical setting whatsoever, and pinpoint timing accuracy. Now, my solution. On my 2.0 liter Type 4 VW, recently replaced by a 2.4 liter Type 4 VW, I run a fully dual redundant electronic ignition system. This consists of two solid state electronic ignitions, salvaged from 1980's motorcycles. These are nice, because: 1 - They have very few components; 2 - They were designed for a very hot, very vibrating environment; 3 - They run from the crankshaft, not the camshaft; no gears involved; 4 - The timing pick-up is magnetic; no mechanical contact, friction, etc. 5 - They are extremely light and compact 6 - They come straight from the junkyard, and cost almost nothing. If one of them fails, I get a warning through engine RPM drop. If my alternator fails, I am warned by an annunciator, plus the ammeter; If my battery fails, I am warned by an annunciator, plus the ammeter; I also have a couple of diodes protecting the electrical circuit . This setting has logged 400 hours on my KR2, without a single glitch. I have no starter, and it does not matter: the engine starts beautifully every time. More sophisticated systems exist, but I doubt if any electronic ignition system can be more reliable or cheaper than that. Now, let's dig quickly, before the magneto fan club attacks... Serge Vidal KR2 "Kilimanjaro Cloud" Paris, France "Robert L. Stone" Envoyé par : krnet-bounces@mylist.net 2005-02-22 18:51 Veuillez répondre à KRnet Remis le : 2005-02-22 18:53 Pour : "KR Builders Pilots" cc : (ccc : Serge VIDAL/DNSA/SAGEM) Objet : KR> Electronic Ignition Netters, I have heard that the modern electronic ignition system is more reliable than the conventional two magneto set-up in all aircraft engines. Assuming this is true, opinions from any of you who are knowledgeable in this area would be welcome. Also does anyone know where if at all an electronic ignition to use on a VW engine is available. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 20:59:05 GMT From: "Jeff Scott" Subject: Re: KR> Electronic Ignition To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20050222.125930.18787.155942@webmail13.lax.untd.com> Content-Type: text/plain FWIW, I've never had both magnetos fail or even complete failure of one magneto in 29 years of aviation (which is not to say that it doesn't happen, 'cause it clearly does). But I have had electronic ignition systems fail, including my 80s vintage motorcycle. Nothing wrong with flying electronic ignition if it's done properly. I've seen lots that are done right, and I have flown some of them. I've also seen a few that I wouldn't go near. For the most part, what I've seen done by the KR builders on the Corvairs and VWs appears to be well thought out and has good redundancy provided that there is sufficient battery behind it to provide enough power in case of electrical failure. As experimental aircraft builders, especially in the USA, we are allowed to build planes for the most part how we see fit. However, the certification process is there for many more reasons than to dig $$ out of your pockets to propagate the use of antiques. The FAA does not require the use of magnetos in certified aircraft. For certification purposes, it does require that if the ignition system is dependant on battery for power that there be a minimum of 30 minute reserve with part of that time under a normal electrical load. So why is it that Cessna and Piper are still using magneto fired engines? OK, Cirrus is a new company doing cutting edge work even using electronic FADEC controls and glass cockpits. So why are their engines magneto fired as well? Think about it. I'm sure their engineers have. -Jeff ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:15:49 -0600 From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: KR> Re: To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <002701c51923$af19caa0$a624c944@yourat5qgaac3z> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi Pat, Please explain, does Great Plains sell an electronic ignition unit with installation instructions? This is what I am looking for if such a thing is available. Thanks much for your response. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: "patrusso" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 2:41 PM Subject: KR> Fw: > Robert Stone > Here is a e mail I got on the subject from one of our KR colleagues a > few > weeks ago. I am running single ignition and feel that the following info > has merit....the choice is still obviously mine...I am sticking with my > Great Plains electronics but would certainly consider two different > ignitions if I had the choice. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Orma > To: patrusso > Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 3:41 PM > Subject: Re: > > > Hello Pat > > Mt Vernon, Ill is just north of St Louis. To register, Go to the KRnet > home page and click on the link to the 2005 gathering web site. As for > the electronic vs. the magneto, mags are old technology and if yours > is > new or in good condition, it should work well. The electronic from GPASC > should also work well, however some of the electronic ignitions are > internally set for the maximum spark advance and will not start the > engine. The mag if it has an impulse coupler will start and then move to > the advanced position. I have on rare occasions seen a mag have > problems. They usually start performing poorly just like all point type > ignition systems. They generally never fail without warning first. That > is not true with the electronic, when they fail it is usually without > warning. I have used the Bosch 009 as a single ignition for a lot of > years. I currently have a Slick and the 009. > Hope this helps. > > Orma > Southfield, MI > N110LR celebrating 20 years > Flying, flying and more flying http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:40:06 -0600 From: "Terry Teer" Subject: KR> KR2S T/D Wanted To: Message-ID: <001501c51927$14f003a0$3cf04fd8@TGSR41610670> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Looking for a finished KR2S conventional geared plane to purchase. Must be well built. E-mail me @ terryteer@bellsouth.net Regards, Terry Teer Ackerman, MS Still building an RV7 Need to fly!! ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:55:10 -0500 From: Subject: KR> Electronic Ignition To: Message-ID: <20050222215509.ZRMO641.fed1rmmtao02.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Netters; For those of you who are interested in electronic ignitions for your KR, you might want to investigate the Subaru EJ-22 engine. It comes right out of the car with an factory EI. I've flown mine for about 50 hours now, and it has worked well. Of course, 50 hours isn't much, but RFI has used over 400 on their auto-gyros and they speak well of them. Not only are they reliable, but the computer automatically adjusts the mixture for you, so you don't need a mixture control. I could go on and on about the advantages and disadvantages, but I will spare you. If you have any questions, you can contact me off the net. RV ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:03:48 -0600 From: "Terry Teer" Subject: KR> KR2S Wanted To: Message-ID: <002501c5192a$660d5dc0$3cf04fd8@TGSR41610670> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Looking for a finished KR2S conventional gear plane. Must be complete and light. Regards, terryteer@bellsouth.net ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:27:51 -0500 From: "Orma" Subject: Re: KR> Electronic Ignition(Subaru Ignition) To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <00cb01c5192d$bfb04470$0202a8c0@ROBBINS1> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hello Net Several of us have considered EFI systems for our VW's. I would like to know if you think that the Subaru system can be adapted to the VW's that we fly. If you have a web page reference that we may refer to in order to view such a system it would be helpful. The junk yards are full of EFI systems, the problem is building a package that is easily adaptable to the VW in a safe and reliable way. Please if you have a good system that might work, don't take it off net. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR Tweety, old enough to drink this year Flying and more flying, to the gathering or bust http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:37:02 -0800 From: larry severson Subject: Re: R?f. : KR> Electronic Ignition To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20050222143604.0216e3b8@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Phil. you responded with my questions first. >Any chance of heaps more info on your Elect Ign system? Photo's. >drawing ??? Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:42:47 -0500 From: Subject: KR> Subaru Ignition To: Message-ID: <20050222224249.ZKHQ27180.fed1rmmtao03.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Netters; The concept of adapting the Subbie ignition to a VW seems to me that it is almost impossible. Most of the sensors that make the Subbie EI so niffty are located on the intake manifold. And the Subbie manifold is probably way to big to adapt to a VW. On the other hand, why would you want to try to adapt it to a VW. It would probably be cheaper and easier just to use the entire Subbie package. The main concerns seem to me would be the addition of a PSRU, radiator and increased weight. By the times you've done all of that, the Corvair seems like a better alternative. I think adapting an EI to the Corvair would be one hell of an idea. RV ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:57:24 EST From: Born2Fly32570@wmconnect.com Subject: KR> What resin to use? To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <1eb.355923c9.2f4d12d4@wmconnect.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Gentleman, I am currently repairing an KR2, and I am at the stage of fiberglassing the turtle shell but I don't know the proper resin to order from aircraft spruce. Please share your wisdom with me. Thanks Ferris Mcgee Milton, FL. N61305 ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:58:48 -0500 From: "patrusso" Subject: Re: KR> Re: To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000801c51932$124220b0$faa672d8@patrusso> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Yes, Great Plains does sell it and installation instructions are with it. In my case, I simply removed the point section (top part) of the std. VW bosch 009 distributer and snapped on the electronic pick up, screwed the module to the firewall and presto,..done. Talk with Steve at great plains,..he'l' set you right. Another great source of expertise is Orma, one of our KR net buddies and the originator of the message I sent you. Good luck ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert L. Stone" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 4:15 PM Subject: KR> Re: > Hi Pat, > Please explain, does Great Plains sell an electronic ignition unit > with > installation instructions? This is what I am looking for if such a thing > is available. Thanks much for your response. > > Bob Stone > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "patrusso" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 2:41 PM > Subject: KR> Fw: > > >> Robert Stone >> Here is a e mail I got on the subject from one of our KR colleagues a >> few weeks ago. I am running single ignition and feel that the >> following info has merit....the choice is still obviously mine...I am >> sticking with my Great Plains electronics but would certainly >> consider two different ignitions if I had the choice. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Orma >> To: patrusso >> Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 3:41 PM >> Subject: Re: >> >> >> Hello Pat >> >> Mt Vernon, Ill is just north of St Louis. To register, Go to the KRnet >> home page and click on the link to the 2005 gathering web site. As for >> the electronic vs. the magneto, mags are old technology and if yours >> is new or in good condition, it should work well. The electronic >> from GPASC should also work well, however some of the electronic >> ignitions are internally set for the maximum spark advance and will >> not start the engine. The mag if it has an impulse coupler will start and then move to >> the advanced position. I have on rare occasions seen a mag have >> problems. They usually start performing poorly just like all point >> type ignition systems. They generally never fail without warning >> first. That is not true with the electronic, when they fail it is usually without >> warning. I have used the Bosch 009 as a single ignition for a lot of >> years. I currently have a Slick and the 009. >> Hope this helps. >> >> Orma >> Southfield, MI >> N110LR celebrating 20 years >> Flying, flying and more flying >> http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ >> _______________________________________ >> Search the KRnet Archives at >> http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html >> > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:00:48 -0600 From: Phil Payne Subject: Re: KR> Subaru Ignition To: KRnet Message-ID: <421BB9A0.8060804@pgrb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Don't mistake the complexity of Fuel Injection with the simplicity of Electronic Ignition. I have a EA-81 sitting in the corner that has EI. It is a conventional appearing distributor with a small black box, about 1 inch X 1/2 inch by 1 inch inside. It sits next to a four corner star wheel on the distributor shaft and acts as a points switch. Two wires lead out of the distributor and connect to a conventional appearing coil. The black box is inside a distributor about the same size as one on the VW. Weights inside the distributor provide advance, no vacuum advance is used. This system could be adapted easily by providing a mounting plate and figuring on how to mount the star wheel to the shaft. I have an O200 on my KR and did not use the EA-81. Phil Payne N39PP ronevogt@cox.net wrote: >Netters; > The concept of adapting the Subbie ignition to a VW seems to me >that it is almost impossible. Most of the sensors that make the Subbie >EI so niffty are located on the intake manifold. And the Subbie >manifold is probably way to big to adapt to a VW. On the other hand, >why would you want to try to adapt it to a VW. It would probably be >cheaper and easier just to use the entire Subbie package. The main >concerns seem to me would be the addition of a PSRU, radiator and >increased weight. By the times you've done all of that, the Corvair >seems like a better alternative. I think adapting an EI to the Corvair >would be one hell of an idea. > >RV > > >_______________________________________ >Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.3.0 - Release Date: 2/21/2005 ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:26:27 -0600 From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> What resin to use? To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <002801c51936$12828840$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Aeropoxy. You can buy it from Wicks or AS&S. Part number for a gallon kit is: 2032-3/4G for the resin 3660-QT for the hardener. It is a 3 to 1 mix. Page 15 of the Wicks 2004-2005 catalog. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 4:57 PM Subject: KR> What resin to use? > Gentleman, I am currently repairing an KR2, and I am at the stage of > fiberglassing the turtle shell but I don't know the proper resin to > order from > aircraft spruce. Please share your wisdom with me. Thanks > > Ferris Mcgee > Milton, FL. > N61305 > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:25:09 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> Re: To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <421BCD65.000007.03176@DANHOMECOMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" You can see the Great Plains Electronic Ignition at http://kr-builder org/FirewallForward/index.html And yes it does come with instructions, but they may leave you with a lot of questions. See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for building has expired. Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC See you in Mt. Vernon - 2005 - KR Gathering -------Original Message------- Please explain, does Great Plains sell an electronic ignition unit with installation instructions? ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 80 ************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================